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 Author  Topic: Looking for MTBRON 21 Photos and Boat Assignment Assistance
Paratrooper82

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Jun 14, 2011 - 8:57am
Sir/Ma'am,

I am looking for photos of MTBRON 21 and assistance in figuring out what PT Boat within MTBRON 21 my grandfather served on- James Lawrence McCay. He was a Carpenter Mates 2nd Class before his discharge.

I have requested and received his Military Personnel Records from St. Louis, National Personnel Records Center, the Muster and Crew Rolls for MTBRON 21 from College Park, National Archives, and the Unit War Diary, also from College Park, National Archives. All of which confirm service in MTBRON 21 but none state what PT Boat my grandfather was on. I have truly hit the wall on what else to ask for or where to look.

I request assistance not as a multi veteran of the current fight, but as a grandson for grandfather I never knew.

Sincerely,
Major Kelly McCay, United States Army

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Ray Wilbur

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Jun 14, 2011 - 9:01am
You can email Alyce at headquarters. She probably can help you.
ptboats@ptboat.org

Ray

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  Jerry Gilmartin

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Jerry Gilmartin   Send Email To Jerry Gilmartin Posted on: Jun 14, 2011 - 10:38am
Major McCay,
Generally speaking, the Carpenter's Mates were not assigned to the crew of a PT Boat, rather he was more likely to have been assigned as part of the "RON21 Base Force" where he would have used his skills in repairing battle damaged PT Boats. It was not unheard of for Carpenter's Mates from the Base Force to sometimes go out on the boats during missions, but like I said, in general, they were not assigned as a crew. The crew was made up of the following Ratings: Gunners Mates, TorpedoMen, RadioMen, Radar Men, QuarterMasters, Motor Machinists Mates, and Ships Cooks. There were also a smattering of others sometimes as well, but those listed were the main ones. I am sure Frank Andruss and some of the PT Boat veterans who read this message board like CJ and Earl can add to this list. I hope this may be useful info. Jerry

Jerry Gilmartin

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Paratrooper82

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Jun 17, 2011 - 6:44am
Ray/Jerry,
Thanks for the responses. I will engage Alyce as well. I actually just did a "Ship's Store" purchase. Speaking of which does anyone know where I can purchase/find CM2 Insignia? I know the rating went away in 1948 and merged with Damage Control. Thanks to all who keep the memory and spirit alive.

Kelly


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Dick

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Dick   Send Email To Dick Posted on: Jun 17, 2011 - 8:12am

Here is a link:

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15646

Also do an image search for:

Carpenter's Mate second class Insignia

http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=off&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=bG37TfueCIfAsAPl4OneBQ&ved=0CDgQBSgA&q=Carpenter%27s+Mate+second+class+Insignia&spell=1&biw=1365&bih=1231



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Paratrooper82

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Jul 9, 2011 - 7:27am
Thanks to Alyce who was able to provide Veteran Documents showing my grandfather's service in the Base Force.

I do have another question. Does anyone have BUPERs Message C.L. 265-44? This was the message that authorized awarding of the PT Insignia. Also curious about the PT Patch sewn above the rank/rating and if there was a PT Insignia Badge (Warfare Insignia).

Kelly


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TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Jul 9, 2011 - 8:47am
I have seen the PT BOAT patch placed above the rank insignia, the left fore arm and the right fore arm. I think theses were placed as to the individual squardrons uniform direction. However, with that said, I originally believe that PT BOAT crew had there patch placed above their rank insignia, while the Squadron support personnel had theirs on the left fore arm, and the base force and tender personnel would have theirs sewn on their right sleeve. However, I have seen boat crew photos of crew in their dress uniforms that don't support my theory. No this doesn't mean I am wrong, because maybe these fellows were originally assigned in one of the other fields and later assigned to a boat and just did not alter their uniform. I just can't prove my theory is correct....Yet.
As for the PT Boat Warfare insignia, there was none, the patch was it. The pins and Tie clips you seen today, (most are reproductions), were originally given by the manufacturers, Elco(Gold and silver 80 footer) and Higgins(PT 450, but the boat represented on the pin is really PT 564 "The Higgins Hellcat", I have mainly seen silver ones, I have only seen one gold and I am not sure if it is not a reproduction) to the comissioning crews of each boat. The officers would get Gold tie clips and the Chiefs Silver, these were later authorized to be worn with their uniform. The ones with the pin back(safety pin type) I don't believe were intended for the uniform, I believe this was intended more of a pin for the guys wife or Mom, but I have seen it placed on a uniform above the medals and with a ruptured duck insignia on the right chest. I am not to sure if the Tie pins you see today were original, I think they were after market recent creations(since 1960 Kennedy election and later with the "Kennedy 60" removed).Later in the war Vosper, Herrschoff, and Harbor Boats came out with their own versions. There is also one that came out for Air Sea rescue boats.
IF ANY ONE HAS MORE INFO ON THESE PLEASE POST IT.
Hope this helps.
Take care,
TED


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