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ť Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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ť Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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ť Topic: New Osprey PT boat book due in September
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=806

Someone posted something about voting for an Osprey book on PT boats on the board a while ago.

It looks like this will become a reality on September 23rd, as Osprey will release a 48-page softcover book titled "US PATROL TORPEDO BOATS: WORLD WAR II," by Gordon Rottman and illustrated by Peter Bull, on that date. It is listed on Amazon for $13.28.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: May 26, 2008 - 1:52pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

Drew
Thanks so much for the information. I just wonder if there is anything else out there that can be written about the PT BOATS that we have not seen before. Two subject matters that have not been touched on would be the MTBSTC ( I think this is presently being worked on ) and the Elco Naval Division. We know a great deal about the boats and the Squadrons, but I would love to see more on the Training of the Officers and Crew, and the Building of the boats and the Men and women who made them. Over the last several years, I have been working on trying to come out with a Book on the Elco naval Division. My book would be a pictorial look at Elco ( I think people relate to seeing the subject matter in pictures ). I do not know on how to get things started, such as publishing and things like that. I had heard it can be pretty expensive to have a book published, and I do not have that kind of money to spend. I hope one day it will be completed ( I have over 300 photographs of the Elco plant ) and I have just about completed the write ups for them. Now everything will need to be transferred onto a disc ( that must take a ton of time.) Oh well, the list goes on and on........

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: May 26, 2008 - 2:11pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

Hopefully, this new Osprey book will be better than their last on RN MTBs. It was full of errors that never should have been made. The author clearly had little knowledge of the boats.

Frank, why not publish your ELCO plant material as a CD? You can compile it using a searchable program like Adobe or even a normal wordprocessing program. Once you had everything compiled, you would only have to produce the CDs as you got orders. Specialist CDs like this one (300 or so photos) can be produced at home for a few dollars and typically sell for around $25.00.

Al Ross

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: May 26, 2008 - 3:37pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

According to the Amazon.com bio, the author of this book, Gordon Rottman, was in the U.S. Army Special Forces (Green Berets) in Vietnam and retired after 26 years service.

What his credentials are as far as a PT boat-history author are, I don't know, but hopefully the book won't be inaccurate, error-filled, or a rehash of previously-presented material, and will have decent illustrations.

We'll see.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: May 26, 2008 - 4:48pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

Thank You very much for the information Dr. Ross, I appreciate it very much...........

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: May 26, 2008 - 5:14pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

A new PT book? When is it due out?

Posted By: TGConnelly | Posted on: Jun 3, 2008 - 12:19pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

The book is scheduled for release on September 23, 2008, according to Amazon.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Jun 3, 2008 - 1:32pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

Thank you Drew.

Posted By: TGConnelly | Posted on: Jun 4, 2008 - 10:58am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

Well, its the 23rd...

Anyone got the low-down on it?

Posted By: WhiteWolf McBride | Posted on: Sep 23, 2008 - 3:23am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

[url]http://www.ptboats.org/cgi-local/sitenetbbs/netboardr.cgi?fid=102&cid=101&tid=990&pg=1&sc=20&x=0[/url]

It comes in the mail today...I guess others could find it at a Borders or Barnes and Noble today?

Grandson of James J Stanton
RON 15 PT 209 and RON 23 PT 243
Check out: www.pistolpackinmama.net

Posted By: newsnerd99 | Posted on: Sep 23, 2008 - 3:32am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

I got an Amazon shipping notice a few days ago so it shouldn't be too long before it shows up.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Sep 23, 2008 - 5:22am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

I got mine last night. save your money. nothing "new". Overview write-up. Some errors- ID Elco as a Higgins.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Sep 24, 2008 - 6:35am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

I agree. A disappointing effort.

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Sep 24, 2008 - 1:16pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Sorry to hear about this disappointing book -- now lots of folks interested in the WWII history of PT boats, who aren't as discriminating as we are and don't know any better, will have gotten inaccurate information.

In the area of WWII history books, I've gotten so that if I don't recognize the name or names involved in such a project as true experts on whatever the subject is, I won't buy it sight unseen, no matter how much it initially excites me.

Unfortunately, there's way too much sloppy research, inaccurate information, and mis-identified photographs out there in the World War II book market.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Sep 27, 2008 - 3:11am
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

There IS an interesting drawing of a Higgins 791-class boat with four turrets. Anyone know if this is bogus or not?

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Sep 27, 2008 - 10:21am
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Will, that caught my eye as well...I had never seen that before.

It was an OK book but certainly not for folks aready in the PT world.

I was please to see some new photos but not as many as I'd like.

Overall...I give it an OK.

Grandson of James J Stanton
RON 15 PT 209 and RON 23 PT 243
Check out: www.pistolpackinmama.net

Posted By: newsnerd99 | Posted on: Sep 27, 2008 - 6:30pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

Never heard of a four turreted Higgins but just because I haven't heard of it doesn't mean it wasn't thought of by Higgins Industries and a factory drawing was made. I would assume that the drawing is probably bogus. Last year Garth Connelly received some questionable drawings, actually they were badly done cut and paste, pirated affairs of Al Ross's PT-109 drawing with a Mk-17 twin 50 mounted in the fore deck like a Vietnam era MK-1 PBR. Now I'm sorry I didn't save it. There were other errors that I can't recall but that bow mounted turret really stands out most in my memory. Could this four turret Higgins drawing be scanned and posted?

Wayne Traxel

Posted By: Wayne Traxel | Posted on: Sep 27, 2008 - 8:26pm
Total Posts: 248 | Joined: Oct 11, 2006 - 5:40am

There is a shot of the boat on the cover of the book (check Amazon, etc.) . Text states that the setup was on the 791-808 class. I imagine Al Ross would know the details, since he has been preparing a volume on the Higgins boats.....

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Sep 28, 2008 - 10:50am
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Hello Will,

Did what you said looked at the enlarged cover of the new Ospry WW-2 PT boat book on Amazon. That four turret Higgins is quite interesting, the second set of turrets also fitted with the aft lockers, just like what is found on the forward turrets of a Higgins. Higgins drawing also features has that box like structure found on the Revell by the radar.

Also the Center Bottom color photo is a Nasty class PTF-17 a Vietnam era craft built by Trumphy and Son's in 1967.

Not trying to be picky, just an observation.

Wayne Traxel

Posted By: Wayne Traxel | Posted on: Sep 28, 2008 - 1:37pm
Total Posts: 248 | Joined: Oct 11, 2006 - 5:40am

My copy hasn't arrived yet, but I do have the tar heating up and the feathers bagged...

The only drawing of the 791 group I've ever seen is one that Bob Ferrell drew many, many years ago. It referenced a BUSHIPS drawing and was essentially identical to a 625 group boat - no extra set of MK17s. The only boats on which I recall seeing free-standing MK17 mounts were several of the 110' SCs converted to PGMs.

Al Ross

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Sep 28, 2008 - 2:55pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

Just looked at the cover on Amazon. The drawings, which are of two different group boats, look suspiciously like those drawn by Bob Ferrell. When my book arrives, I'm going to make overlays of Bob's drawings and see just how they line up.

Al Ross

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Sep 28, 2008 - 3:16pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

Cool! Thanks, Al.

Wayne - That Nasty-class PTF is identified correctly inside the book.

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Sep 28, 2008 - 5:07pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Hello Will,

Must have missed the "and PTF's of Vietnam" part of the title

Sorry about that.

Wayne Traxel

Posted By: Wayne Traxel | Posted on: Sep 29, 2008 - 4:02pm
Total Posts: 248 | Joined: Oct 11, 2006 - 5:40am

Well, my copy arrived today...This has to be the worst book on PTs I've ever seen. Aside from being a rehash of previously-presented material, it is rife with factual errors and sloppy editing. Based on his misuse of terms and misidentifed boats, I doubt the author knows much about boats in general and PTs in particular. For example, he uses the term 'fantail' when referring to at least two different portions of the boats, neither of which is correct. The lower photo on page 11 is identifed as the engineroom hatch on an ELCO - it's clearly a Higgins. The top photo on page 18 identifies the boats under construction as Higgins - they're 70' ELCOs. The bottom photo on page 18 identifies the boat as an ELCO PTC - it's a 70' Higgins built for the Royal Netherlands Navy. On page 16, the caption for the color rendering of the Higgins identifies the torpedo tubes as MK18s, which are the ELCO tubes - Higgins tubes are MK19s. On page 20, the radar on the HELLCAT (PT 564) is identified as SC, which was a large, "bedspring" antenna fitted to destroyers. The cutaway is grossly disproportionate and inaccurate. On page 40, PT 174 is described as having a shielded 37mm on the bow - it was a 40mm, which looks nothing like the 37mm M4 or M9 (the latter is never mentioned). The author's comments on construction and camouflage border on ludicrous. Etc, etc., etc................arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh!

Al Ross

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Sep 29, 2008 - 5:30pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

Sounds Like a Job foe SUPERMAN.....................

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Sep 29, 2008 - 6:40pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

I agree WHOEHEARTEDLY with Al Ross. That book is a waste of $17.95! My book - even with all its errors is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than this book.

Posted By: TGConnelly | Posted on: Sep 30, 2008 - 1:40pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

I finally got to peruse a copy of this disappointing book at my local hobby shop yesterday, and I guess I have to agree with the mostly negative reviews.

Other than several not-too-bad-looking full-page color plates (the PT 109 one, in particular), there's not much there, and too much inaccurate information -- inexcusable, at this late date.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Oct 4, 2008 - 1:50pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

THAT is about the only accurate thing in the book.

Posted By: TGConnelly | Posted on: Oct 4, 2008 - 3:49pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered