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Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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Topic: 1/72 PT-109 photos - almost ready for the paint shop
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=427



Greetings all,
Well I'm just about ready to send PT-109 to the paint shop. It's been a long road. I thought it would be a good idea to post the before shots. If you're familiar with the kit you'll notice that about all that is on this model from the original Revell kit is the basic hull and deck fixtures. Everything else is WEM photo etch, parts, and a lot of scratch building. I'm very nervous about laying down the paint but I'm ready to finish this boat up.
Dave

[IMAGE]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n27/David_Waples/IMG_1032.jpg[/IMAGE]

[IMAGE]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n27/David_Waples/IMG_1031.jpg[/IMAGE]

[IMAGE]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n27/David_Waples/IMG_1030.jpg[/IMAGE]

[IMAGE]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n27/David_Waples/IMG_1029.jpg[/IMAGE]


David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 17, 2007 - 9:28pm
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



Very nice work. I see a lot of attention to detail. Are those the kit's tubes? What color will you be painting?
Ed



Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 3:20am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am



Hi Ed,
Those are not the kit tubes. I created masters by using styrene tubing, strip, etc. I used the kit torpedo tube cover only. I used WEM photo etch parts for the rear of the tube to get that nice web effect and added their turnbuckles to the final casting. Finally I modified the WEM torpedo mounts to cover them correctly and used the top piece of the each mount on the boat itself. The ignitor is scratch from styrene and turned into a mold too.

The real fun were the ammo guides on the turrets. I cast those as well. They're slightly out of scale but I felt like they needed to be to accept the photo etch ammo belts that I will be using.

It will be painted green and I have some numbers from Archer that look pretty good too. The green has yet to be determined but my hope is to mix some tropical with some dark green and dark gray. I'm going to a paint mixing class early next month. Maybe I'll learn something that will save the project. Or maybe somebody will find that elusive color photo of the boats from this squadron.... nah, I couldn't get that lucky. They'll appear after I"m done.

Stand by.
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 4:41am
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



All the railings and depression rails are soldered brass. I didn't like the photo etch in this scale. The only photo etch I used for depression rails was at the base of the .20mm rail. It also came from WEM.

I used Aires resin .50 cal guns to replace the kit guns.

Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 4:46am
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



Dave, I am quite impressed. It looks much better than any 1/72 PT photo i have seen anywhere.

Did you choose to not use a starboard depth charge and rack or are they just not placed yet?

A little hard to see in the photo but it looks like you made a gap in the port toe rail where the DC was ripped off during the torpedo accident. Nice touch.

WEM makes a tropical green that might fill the bill. It is supposed to look like the locally aquired green painted over the grey boats. I used their paints on my 1/35 495 build and after some practice got to really like them. You can get them locally from Meteor Products.

If you plan on weathering the boat, let me know, and , if you are interested, I will tell you what I did in case you like the effect.

You might want to think about having Gator make you some paint masks for the boat numbers. They work and look much more real the decals.

Ed



Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 5:03am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am



Dave,

Some excellent work there, sir. I like a lot of the little details you've picked out that haven't been seen on previous 80' Elco models, such as the thigamajig just behind the most forward port side window (port) of the dayroom (what was that thing, anyway?).

I'd love to discuss your model off line, if you're amenable.

My email is: RAC701@msn.com



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 12:31pm
Total Posts: 1236 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



Hi Ed,
I've done more to this boat than most sane people would do, that's for sure. I've been talking about the Revell 109 boat and what's wrong with it for a long time and figured I should build it based on what I've learned and it was a great opportunity to develop some new modeling skills such as the depression rails. I still need to do that on the 1/48 scale 105 boat too.

Good catch on the toe rail. That makes me feel good because that's exactly the image I want to get across. The depth charges are off to the side along with smoke generator, .50 cal's, and various details like the driving mechanism for the torpedo tubes. There will be no mast because the evidence indicates that the 109 at this time didn't have one. Everything is well hidden and protected from the cats.

I just can't bring myself to paint the boat WEM tropical green. I have a bunch of it along with MTB green. I do love their paints though. What I've been kicking around is a combination of tropical green mixed with another shade of green like MTB green to lighten it up and then adding gray. The look I'm shooting for is the same as the boats were painted in the movie. If you look at that color it has hints of tropical green in it. I've experimented with it and I like the look of it and it's also a way of saying thanks to John Snyder and Al Ross for their input.

I would very much appreciate more detail on the wash. I certainly plan on doing that on this boat. If you look at photos of the 109 it is very blotchy (if that's a word) so weathering is going to be very important.

I have dry transfers from Archer that I was going to use. But tell me about Gator? I'm not familiar.

Thanks
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 5:43pm
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



Hey Drew,
Well that little thingie according to Al Ross' drawings is a LUX Pull and I have no idea what that is. Hopefully he'll read this and tell us.

Feel free to drop a line. My email is davidwaples@comcast.net

I'll be glad to share anything I can and I'm always open to feedback and ideas.

Thanks
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 18, 2007 - 5:46pm
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



Hi Dave.
I used the WEM enamals thinned with lacquer thinner at about 1:1. It is critical that you mix the paint very well. I stir it a lot and note the level of paint in the tin. Then i pour the paint into a mixing bottle. I fill the tin to the original level with thinners and stir it a lot then pour that into the mixing bottle. The tin should be pretty much totally clean. Then mix in the bottle until it is completely mix and then stir some more.

For reference, here are photos of my build:
[url]http://modelshipwrights.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=1578[/url]

I painted with color as-formulated until i got the coverage I wanted. Then I added some flat white. Add just enough to tell that it is slightly lighter. Then I sprayed the hull in rapid vertical, perpendicular to the keel, passes from stem to stern. Some strokes covered the entire span (top to bottom) from a constant distance. Others started at the top at the same distance and moved down and out to feather the effect. Other did the same but went bottom to top. I moved quickly from stem to stern to leave areas with original color. You want stripes or narrow band that are random in spacing.

Then I lightened the paint a little more and repeated the process but moving faster to apply less paint on different, but still random spacing. some of these passes overlapped the original color, some overlapped the first lightened pass. The effect is random variations of many shades of the paint.

For the overheads and deck I workedalso from stem to stern and the verticals were do top to bottom. On the deck I then added additional shades in "traffic" areas. On the 495, I believe the deck was originally painted in the camo pattern before getting overpainted with deck green so I painted the pattern first. The deck green was applied at various thinknesses to allow the sub-paint to vary the saturation of the deck green.

I used Gator's masks for the boat numbers and insignia and sprayed them with a slightly dirty white and insignai blue followed with a quick pass of lightened blue as with the boat.

The masks are adheasive backed vinyl pre lasor cut to produce the desired markings. Once you use then they are easy and work great. The painted numbers and stars just look right and there is not decal silvering or edge to worry about. He makes customs and the price is very good.
[url]http://www.gatorsmask.com/[/url]
I uesed custom masks for the stand nameplate. When i ordered mine i told him what i wanted and the size and asked for a few "practice" pieces to experiment with.

After all this was dry, I sprayed a few good coats of future. Let it dry for a day or 2.

Next I bought a tube of oil paint in raw umber and mixed it with mineral spirits (paint thinner). I ended up with a sludge (not too wet) that I brushed on the mdel in the direction of the paint weathering with a wide, flat brush. I did sections at a time. Try to not break up areas that are contunous because you don't want to see breaks or overlaps in the effect halfway down the hull for example. As soon as you finish applying a section, wipe it off with a lint-free cloth and/or q-tips. Only wipe in the direction that natural streaking would occur. Be careful not to wipe to hard or too often and go through the future polish. It is tough but not perfect.

Once the wash is on and the way you like it, let it dry and then spray some dullcoat lacquer thinned 10% with lacquer thinner. don't get it on too wet.

If you want to do the marine growth at the waterline, I used and acrylic tube color called Tree Sap and sprayed lots of thin layers using a mask held off the hull to get a defined but feathered edge.

overall, keep in mind that the wash will darken your colors and give a slightly brown tint. With my 495 build I started with a lighter green for the light green color knowing the end result would be darker. I suggest experimenting with the colors, weathering, future and oils before doing the 109.

BTW,
if you use future and then don't like the wash, any cleaner with amonia, like windex, will wash the future and anything sprayed on top of the future right off so you can start over without damage to the base paint job, at least if you used WEM emanals.
Hope this helps. i can't wait to see more of your outstanding build.
Ed



Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Jul 19, 2007 - 6:24am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am



Hey Dave - I have noticed in many photos of boats "Out In The Area" that they take a fair amount of beating along the deck edges and chines from incidental contact with foreign objects. Any plans to replicate this on the 109?

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Jul 19, 2007 - 9:39am
Total Posts: 1858 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm



Ed,
Thanks for all the great detailed information. I'm going to practice on a 2nd PT kit that I have to make sure I find a finish I'm satisfied with. I'm also going to attend a class on mixing paints since I think that will be required for this project.

Will,
You bet. This was one weathered and damaged boat by the time she was sunk. I think Will's weathering technique will lend itself well towards that result.

It will probably be in mid August before I lay on the final paint.
Stay tuned and if I have any questions I'll be reaching out.

Thanks for the encouragement.
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Jul 19, 2007 - 8:37pm
Total Posts: 1574 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm