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» Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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» Topic:
PT195 camo
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=4257
[url]http://www.pt103.com/images/ptpics/PT_362_325_The_Outlaw_195_Black_Agnes_Unknown_Cape_Gloucester_Landings_1944_Detail_03.jpg[/url]
Hello,
Can anyone help with a port side view of a boat with a similar hull camouflage pattern to PT195 in this photo?
The only photos I can find of boats with this DIY measure 5P (PT183, PT180) only show the starboard side. I would like to include this pattern in my 195 build as I reckon it was probably still there up until she was repainted in measure 31/20L
Thanks.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 24, 2017 - 7:45am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
It sort of resembles Measure 31-7P
Will
Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Apr 24, 2017 - 3:39pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm
Oops, Measure 32-7P
Will
Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Apr 24, 2017 - 3:41pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm
This is the more common iteration of 31 5P. The deck on an ELCO would have been Deck Green (20G). [url]https://www.cybermodeler.com/naval/ptboat/ptboat_profile31-5.shtml [/url]
(Ignore the color charts on this page...)
Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Apr 24, 2017 - 3:52pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm
Hi Stu, a bit off topic but did you notice the twin .50s on the bow are on a mk17 mount.It is likely that this same mount was moved at the end of the stbd footrail when the 37mm was installed... there also is an anchor stowed on deck,looks like it would fit between the 20mm gun deck pad and the later fitted ammo box;the anchor was stowed on official brackets, clearly visible on the Panama picture... A little speculative but likely[:-cheers-:]
Daniele Kläy
Posted By: Daniele Klay | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 3:51am
Total Posts: 126 | Joined: Jun 23, 2015 - 12:43pm
Daniele,
I have been staring at the photo quite a bit.
You are probably correct about the twin mount.
Other things of note are the .50 mounted near the stbd bridge wing inboard of the torpedo rack (pointing aft), the small ammo box by the daycabin and the large box in front of the charthouse. There appears to be a signal lamp on the mast but this is gone in later pics.
I reckon there would be marks in the deck where the aft racks and depth charges were moved, maybe some holes etc?
As I am modeling a water base I am planning to run an anchor rope into the water. I have been collecting suitable figures for modeling crew at rest. Just about there now.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 4:21am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
You the man Al!
[image]http://i.imgur.com/4m64RvY.gif[/image]
When would they have used MTB Green on the deck / horizontal surfaces?
Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 5:26am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am
This is the more common iteration of 31 5P. The deck on an ELCO would have been Deck Green (20G). [url]https://www.cybermodeler.com/naval/ptboat/ptboat_profile31-5.shtml [/url]
(Ignore the color charts on this page...)
Thanks Al
It may be that I will just go with a 'guesstimate' of the port side. It looks like the general 5P scheme was often interpreted in different ways by inverting the shaded areas and swapping the designs between sides. I have some idea about the port bow area at least.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 5:58am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
Oops, Measure 32-7P
Will
Thanks Will,
I am hoping something will come up to prevent me having to guess the pattern from the bow back.
As the pattern on the stbd side of PT195 resembles the port side pattern on the painting guide maybe it will turn out the port side looks like the stbd side in the guide and they just swapped it round.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 6:06am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
The houses appear spotted:
[image]http://www.pt103.com/images/ptpics/PT_195_Ray_Bean_Cropped.jpg[/image]
Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 6:49am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am
Jeff,
Yes, I noticed that too. Looks cool, makes me want to do another 195 to this specification. Maybe a 'before and after' project.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 6:56am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
This is the more common iteration of 31 5P. The deck on an ELCO would have been Deck Green (20G). [url]https://www.cybermodeler.com/naval/ptboat/ptboat_profile31-5.shtml [/url]
(Ignore the color charts on this page...)
Al - as usual - is the Master of Time, Space, and Dimension.
More useful color charts are issued by Snyder & Short, "U.S. Navy World War II Ship Colors, Set 2". These are highly-acclaimed actual paint chips produced after extensive research.
[url]http://shipcamouflage.com[/url]
Although I have to say they failed to include British Racing Green. [:-laughing-:]
Cheers!
--Bob
Posted By: Bob Steinbrunn | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 9:01am
Total Posts: 134 | Joined: Jan 23, 2016 - 9:16am
Stuart;
I suggest you contact Wayne Traxall, he was the one who was in contact with PT 195 Skipper Bill Diver.
As can be determined by the 26 December 1944 photos Jeff posted, The boat was probably repainted when the Maxon was added, The Russ Pullano photos show that 195 was later painted in a version of Measure 31/20L.
Take care,
TED
Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 9:18am
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am
While we are at it; does anybody know for sure where the quadmount later fitted to PT195 came from? Because if it originated from an M51 trailer the quadmont would be an M45 on the other hand if the donor was an M16MGMC it would be an M45D (main difference the cannoneer's platform).
All for accurancy's sake[:-good-:]
Daniele Kläy
Posted By: Daniele Klay | Posted on: Apr 25, 2017 - 11:40am
Total Posts: 126 | Joined: Jun 23, 2015 - 12:43pm
Daniele,
I searched through the PT195 diary and although the quad is mentioned it does not say where they got it. It does, however list the armaments at that time and states that there were two twin .50 cal mounts on the deck, one stbd and forward of the cockpit (the one we know about Mk 46 mount?) and also one port and aft of the cockpit. . Stored below were two .30 cal Lewis guns. The only evidence of a mount on the port side I can find is the wing mounted tube pedestal though.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 26, 2017 - 5:17am
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am
Stu;
In Jeff's photo of 195 at Cape Gloucester, you can see a single .50 port aft of the cockpit, the barrel is in front of the blond guy in the cockpit. I guess it was converted to a twin mount later.
A photo of PT 191 alongside USS Wachapreague shows a mount in the same location.
On PT 196 there looks to be a pipe mounted twin mount in this same location, port side spray shield.
Take care,
TED
Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Apr 27, 2017 - 9:23am
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am
Ted,
I am seeing it now, thanks, I have seen the pipe mount on 195 port side wing.in the New Guinea pics.
Best Regards,
Stu.
Posted By: Stuart Hurley | Posted on: Apr 27, 2017 - 10:55pm
Total Posts: 255 | Joined: Mar 19, 2013 - 3:32am