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» Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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» Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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» Topic:
Diorama Dilemma
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Well now that I have got caught up on all the side projects of the 623 so far and I now have a little more play space, it's time to start the next project. I have been collecting Italeri 596 kits for about a year now and need to get my forward base built for them. So, I'm asking you all for some suggestions here. My fictitious PT base will be just that. Not modeled after a specific location or time period which will allow me the freedom to place a variety of 80 footers at the same location. So what I would like from all of you is suggestions on which 80 footers you think had a "significant " moment in time in the South Pacific. I have room for 7 boats so of course one will be the 109 and the other must be a mini-me 623. Other thoughts I had were the 190 and maybe the 480. Of course if Italeri produces a 77 footer, there must be space for the 41 boat and if the Higgins comes out first, it will the 658 boat for my buddies up in Portland. So come on guys, hit me with your best shot !!
Thanks for your help.
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 7:59am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Tough call on what boats to build, as they all had special meaning for their Crews. You do know that throwing in a bunch of different Squadron boats in one area will certainly not be correct, but I guess you mentioned that. Too bad you can't pick say two squadrons that were based together and build that way, picking out certain boats from only those Squadrons. Just a thought here, so that you would be correct when all is said and done. You can fudge the base, but throwing in 7 different boats from 7 different Squadrons is not the way to go in my mind.
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 9:37am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
I really did struggle with this. So that's why I decided that rather a specific moment in time at a specific place I would do a "history" of sort but in a real looking setting. Gives me much more freedom to "create". So besides the 109, any suggestions?
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 10:27am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Roy,
My take?
YOU do what YOU'D LIKE TO DO ....... and what you feel is right.
Posted By: TGConnelly | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 10:31am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered
Hi Roy,
I think you should model Mios Woendi PT Base. They had both Higgins and Elco boats there, and it looked like the idyllic south pacific paradise style island. Plus it was not too large, so you could be fauirly accurate. Having numerous piers sticking out into the water with 3-4 boats at each looks pretty impressive as well. Or you could model the Base at Mindoro in the southern Phillipines at the beginning of 1945 with a similar mix of boats Even PT66 Cheetah (77 ft Elco)I think was there at one point. ( You know the one with the sharksmouth?)
Just a suggestion. Jerry PT658
Jerry Gilmartin
Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 11:33am
Total Posts: 1473 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm
I have always thought that the 363 and 489 boats in Wasile Bay trim would make a good pairing.
Will
Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 4:34pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm
Roy;
I agree with Jerry, if your going to do one go for Mios Woendi PT Base. As well as the National Achieves photos, Rumsey Ewing took some awesome black and whites of this base, I have a few if you want me to send them. When I looked through the HQ photos, I could always seperate Rumsey's photos from the rest, they are fantastic.
Take care,
TEd
Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Feb 4, 2013 - 8:13pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am
Roy, I had been thinking about this, and maybe what would make for a great display would be BASE 17 in the Philippines. Many choices for buildings and piers, and here you would have no problem putting in whatever boats you wished. BASE 17 had many different Squadrons displaced there and you could have the boats in many areas, to include fueling, dry-dock, torpedo/carrier, engine repair, you name it. I have many photo's of the base which would help you. Just another thought I had.
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 4:05am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
Roy,
In the spirit of your initial thought, how about the 167 with the torpedo hole in it !
[:-grin-:]
Steve
Posted By: Nuge210 | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 6:17am
Total Posts: 323 | Joined: Jun 4, 2008 - 7:50am
Ahoy there.
For something a bit different how about PT-156 with the 20 mm in the forawrd turret. Did it have a 20 mm in the aft turret?
Cheers
"Give me a fast boat for we want to get out of harm's way too."
Posted By: PeterTareBuilder2 | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 9:28am
Total Posts: 204 | Joined: Dec 8, 2012 - 6:03pm
Oooh! Ooooh! I know!
Make a Squadron full of Zebra Boats! Especially the one with the 40mm gun emplacement on the bow! Dedicate it to Frank Andruss!
Jerry
Jerry Gilmartin
Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 12:39pm
Total Posts: 1473 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm
Awesome thoughts guys. And I forgot about the boats with the 20mm in the forward turrets. My head is spinning already !! Keep them coming
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 1:12pm
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Hey Jerry, that's funny as heck but Frankie A thinks I'm a pretty good guy and besides, I almost have him ready to ship me my flag, engine and helmet for my new PT room so I don't want to get on his bad side now.
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 1:15pm
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Jerry, your going to get it for even thinking about that Zebra Boat, I'm going to buy white and black paint, sneak over to the 658 and spray paint her into a Zebra HIGGINS. That's good Roy, stay on my god side, Stan will have that Packard made up soon, lol.................
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 5, 2013 - 5:14pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
AWWWW You guys, Jerry tit for tat while Frank is over painting the 658 you should be over doing likewise to his house, that will go down well with the locals.
Think of it as this, at least you will both be doing something Boat related and you will both be catching up on your cam skills although you would have to be a little twisted to do that
Thats ok it appears you both qualify.
Have a good night.
D.buck
Posted By: David Buck | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 2:40am
Total Posts: 332 | Joined: May 4, 2008 - 2:59am
You could be right, Jerry and I might be a bit twisted, although having Jerry paint my house might be a bit too much, I may have to shoot him in the fanny with my 37mm auto Cannon, and if someone ever decides to redo an Elco, we might have to dual it out on the water ways.
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 7:07am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
Hi Roy, How about a what If PT-109 wasn't rammed and survived the war senario. What would be her appearence in 1945 near the end of the war docked near the Mk-12 20mm forward turretted PT-157?
Wayne Traxel
Posted By: Wayne Traxel | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 8:34am
Total Posts: 248 | Joined: Oct 11, 2006 - 5:40am
You hit it on the head Wayne. That description your made "what if" is the perfect way to describe that moment in time I'm aiming going to create. I should have said that in my original post. What if a few of the boats that achieved some historical significance during the war all met for a reunion of sorts, who would be there. Great. So, yes the 109 tied next to the 157 is a must. I would invite the 191 boat from the Vitiaz Strait Ordeal and having the highest barge kill and maybe the 480 as I know the 40mm gunner and she did transport "Doug" at one point. Please keep the ideas coming. I love the way you described the idea. Thanks
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 9:29am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Hi Roy, Glad you liked the Idea. PT-191 is an excellent choice. Should Italeri make a 77'er, a model PT-41, the boat that took Mac from Corregidor in 42, docked near PT-373, the boat that brought him back to Corregidor in 45 with PT-323 nearby. Other possibilities include Higgins PT-300,and PT-73 docked near PT-658. This is fun!
Wayne Traxel
Posted By: Wayne Traxel | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 10:05am
Total Posts: 248 | Joined: Oct 11, 2006 - 5:40am
I'm sitting here on the floor laying this all out and now you have me thinking about extending it around on to the next wall. I'm already at 12 feet.
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 11:34am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Roy, how about a half and half; half dedicated to the boats that made it (in some way) through the war:
PT's 191 (Vitiaz Strait), 489 (Wasile Bay rescue), PT 45 (Guadalcanal, sank destroyer Teruzuki), PT 59 (Guadalcanal, sank submarine 1-3), PT 373 (took MacArthur back to Corregidor).
And a memorial (of sorts) to boats and crews that didn't make it...
PT 109, PT 41, PT 37 (lost with all but one of the crew 2-1-43) PT 337 (lost in Hansa Bay 3-3-43; five survivors), PT 300 (lost to kamakaze 12-18-44).
Posted By: comcardiv1 | Posted on: Feb 6, 2013 - 4:31pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered
You know Frank at the rate that Roy is going he would be better off building a full size Elco.
Now all you would have to do then would be vvvery nice to him during the build and he may lend you the Boat, hey presto your battle royal with Jerry is on however you would have to let everyone know were and when as I'm sure there will be many who would want to watch.
Roy I hope you don't mind the sidelines, the Boats that have been suggested are great and as I would only be repeating what has already been put forward I will be looking forward to your final outline. ( However I do sorta like the 77" boats from Ron 3 so I like the idea of PT41 in there) I know its hard as there is no model in 1/35 yet.
We keep pushing maybe one day!
D.buck
Posted By: David Buck | Posted on: Feb 8, 2013 - 3:16am
Total Posts: 332 | Joined: May 4, 2008 - 2:59am
Tough to try and figure out just which boats to try and build. So many of them were in Combat, and ran into the enemy quite a bit. For instance there is Bill Paynter's PT-362 which saved the crew of PT-363, which was dead in the water. Shore batteries peppered the 363, while Paynter made firing runs to take some of the heat off of the 363. Under heavy fire, Paynter and the 362, boarded the 363 to take off the wounded men for transfer. Paynter won the Silver Star for this action. Good luck in trying to figure out just what boats to try and model. I agree that the most famous boats we read about are the 109, 41, and 157, but there were other boats that paid the price and get little recognition..........
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 8, 2013 - 5:35am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
Dave
I like your idea of Roy building a full sized Elco. He certainly has plenty of room in that new house addition he just put up, so maybe we could send him some funds for this massive project. Then I could give Jerry a run for his money on the water........
Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Feb 8, 2013 - 5:37am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am
I love all the suggestions guys. I would love to have a few 77 footers at the "what if" reunion but that will have to wait for our friends at Italeri. I will however make some adjustments in the frame work for the base of the diorama so it can be extended around to the next wall. Frank and I have had the same dream many times about "what if" we hit the lottery and could build that full size boat. My problem would be where to keep it. San Diego or right at the place where it all started. The new Elco Boat Basin only 10 south of where I grew up. OH, I know, how about a 77 footer in Bayonne and an 80 footer at North Island. [olive]Somebody please wake me up !![/olive]
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 8, 2013 - 8:15am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Roy to quote a once famous bard,
"To sleep and perchance to dream'.
If only it were possible to make this one come true what fun one could have.
I am looking after my six week old grandson who is intently watching the screen as I type this. Who knows maybe PT Boats are in his future.
D.buck
Posted By: David Buck | Posted on: Feb 10, 2013 - 12:42pm
Total Posts: 332 | Joined: May 4, 2008 - 2:59am
Hey Roy-
I know that whatever you decide to do with your diorama, it will be a jaw dropper. Go with your gut feeling, and don't mind all the critics. It's "YOUR" project after all. I've given you a lot of advise so just go with the flow, buddy, and you'll be rewarded for your efforts!
Frank Ryczek
modeler/Friend RON-10 PT-169 " ZEBRA SNAFU"
HIGH TIDES ALWAYS!
YOUR FRIEND THROUGH SCALE SHIP MODELING AND PT BOAT HISTORY!
Posted By: FRANK | Posted on: Feb 14, 2013 - 1:26pm
Total Posts: 349 | Joined: Oct 7, 2007 - 2:09pm
Thanks for the encouragement Frank. Looks like it's going to be the 109 docked alongside the 157 on the first dock. The 191 and 373 on the second. The 623 up on the rails which leaves me room for 1 at the fuel dock & 1 loading torpedoes. Maybe by the time I get this much done, Italeri will release the 77 footer so of course that would cover the 41 boat then all I need is a Higgins. If I run out of room it's on to the next wall and the XO has no say in the PT room about that. Ha
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 18, 2013 - 2:49pm
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Hi Roy,
I wanted to suggest two other relatively famous PT Boats PT489 and PT363, you may recall these were the 2 boats that dashed in under constant Japanese Shore Artillery barrage to rescue downed pilot ENS Hank Thompson in Wasile Bay, Halmahera and for which LT Murray Preston was eventually awarded the MEDAL OF HONOR. Everyone seems to forget that one it seems. And nobody seems to remember those two boats. Jerry
Jerry Gilmartin
Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Feb 18, 2013 - 11:57pm
Total Posts: 1473 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm
Outstanding suggestion Gerry. The 489 boat is on my list but has not been assigned a docking location as of yet. I would also like to add that there will be a granite memorial stone with a flag pole like the one Frankie had made up in Mass (only much smaller) remembering all those who could not attend this "what if" reunion. Great ideas guys. Thanks so much for all the great input.
Posted By: Roy Forbes | Posted on: Feb 19, 2013 - 7:42am
Total Posts: 371 | Joined: Sep 5, 2012 - 4:57pm
Very interesting discussion!
Roy, if you ever go with the 41 boat, then how about including the 525? MacArthur left Corregidor on 12 Mar 1942 on PT-41 to arrive at an airfield on Mindanao. Then, he returned to Tacloban, Leyte on PT 525 on 24 Oct 1944. The 525 could be 'towing' the 41 boat back!
I like the idea of Mios Woendi as far as a base. Have seen some nice photos of the island.
No matter what you choose Roy, it sounds like it will be great. Have fun.
Randy Finfrock
Posted By: Randy Finfrock | Posted on: Feb 22, 2013 - 3:37pm
Total Posts: 97 | Joined: Nov 27, 2006 - 6:21pm