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» Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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» Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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» Topic: Curious error in the kit
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=2951



OK, I'll start with I really, really like this kit. [:-cheers-:][:-cheers-:]

But, for some reason, Italeri chose to put a raised rim with what appear to be simulated rivets around the deck edge. [:-question-:] It doesn't appear in the Type Sections drawings or the plan views, nor is it visible in the photos at which I looked.

Check out this one of 103:[IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/Photo_Scan_PT_103_Port_Bridge_Torpedo.jpg[/IMaGe]

The deck edge is perfectly flush with the top of the deck. I think what they did was misinterpret the rabbet in the covering board.

Al



Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Dec 3, 2012 - 7:11pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm



In addition, that's a nice CU of how the hulls got dinged up just from normal use......

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Dec 3, 2012 - 9:31pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm



That's odd. Does their 596 model have the same rim / rivets?

Another oops is the sternlight. Included is the one for PTs 565-624 which looks like a mini anchor light sitting on a shelf. It should be an easy enough fix.




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 2:02am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



Hi Al,
I'm glad you like the kit but it does have a few issues. I wrote a full review for model warships.com and am waiting to post anything additional until it appears there first. But the rim detail is something I commented on. Also at the stern there's some unusual frame scribing. The 596 kit is designed the same way. Although they completely remade the deck they used the same assembly technique using screws and screw covers for assembly. From talking with Massimo they're not satisfied with it but didn't know what else to do. I know when I build her I will remove all of that rim riveting and rescribe the stern planking.

You'll also notice that the bow curves down as it should but the stern does not have the upward flare that it should. If you set it down on something perfectly flat you'll see that the hull top is perfectly flat except for the bow. An easy fix with some styrene on about the last 10 scale feet of the hull should fix that along with some correction of the trim to match the new contour of the deck (if that makes sense). Or... you could just not worry about it. :-)

The other big issue is the armor on the port side of the helm. Unless you want to model the boat with the armor removed, and some of them were as we've seen in photos, you'll need to cover the framing with some thin plastic stock or brass and delete the small piece of photoetch Italeri provided. They're aware of the error now and have said they will fix it in future releases.

Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 4:56am
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



I look forward to your review David.I'm glad that for the most part it is a faithful rendition. If you and Al like it, you know its good.

Here's a shot of what the sternlight looked like on the 103-196 & 314-367 + boats, it's the slightly larger diameter section about half way up from the base:

[image]http://www.pt103.com/images/asst/PT_174_Stern_Flagstaff.jpg[/image]




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 5:25am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



The correct stern flagstaff and light is included in the kit. I'm not sure why they threw in the newer style. As mentioned before there are also two cockpit options with different style doors. I have to tell you I will probably be tempted to make that flagstaff out of brass tubing. and maybe incorporate a wood flagstaff as in the photo. Our glimpse of the 109 shows the flag back there since there is no mast on the 109. We've seen this on other Elco's with no mast. Thanks for the picture Jeff!
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 5:59am
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



You Guys are great!
By the time mine gets here, all the kinks will be set straight, Thanks!

Al, thanks for reposting the PT 103 "Robert Mongomery" photo, as it shows the deck edge very nicely.
Take care,
TED



Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 6:31am
Total Posts: 3058 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am




I look forward to your review David.I'm glad that for the most part it is a faithful rendition. If you and Al like it, you know its good.

Here's a shot of what the sternlight looked like on the 103-196 & 314-367 + boats, it's the slightly larger diameter section about half way up from the base:

[image]http://www.pt103.com/images/asst/PT_174_Stern_Flagstaff.jpg[/image]




Are those mops in font of the smoke generator the ones used to paint the boat? VBEG ;<)

A very nice sharp and clear photo.

Thanks and cheers

"Give me a faster PT boat for I'd like to get out of harm's way!"

Posted By: PeterTareBuilder | Posted on: Dec 4, 2012 - 12:24pm
Total Posts: 494 | Joined: Jun 24, 2008 - 5:59pm



One thing I noticed on the photo etch was the bridge windshield parts are all one piece. Do the instructions call for cutting it apart? The only pieces on the outside should be the corner angles and center strip. It should be a real easy fix if not. Here's a render of it, the black strips are actually rubber strips under the plexiglass and not framing:

[image]http://www.pt103.com/images/PT_Boat_Elco_103_Class_Bridge_And_Chart_House_Perspective_Port_Fwd.jpg[/image]

Here's a shot from Gene's site, note the underlying rubber:

[image]http://www.pt-king.gdinc.com/12-05.jpg[/image]




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 5:59am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



The instructions do not call for cutting it apart. Definitely something I will be paying attention to on the build. Many of the boats, like the 109, painted the windshield but I think I would remove the bottom section of the photoetch and probably replace with some small rivet detail on the exterior of the windscreen. Great observation Jeff.
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 6:05am
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm



Everyone;
Well through all this dark and firey by play, I managed to learn something new today, and I have always been told if you learn something new everyday, then that day was worth it! Today I learned the term :Carte Clanche , believe it or not, it is actually on Youtube as a techno music remix video: Verocha-Carte Clanche !!
All these years I thought it was Carte Blanche??
another Idea.......Dick can you install a spellcheck here, because sometimes with my speed the idea does not always hit the keys in the correct odor.....OOOPS!!!! See what I mean? I meant Order!!!
Take care,
TED



Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 11:25am
Total Posts: 3058 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am



Ted, I see spelling errors in red as I type. A context checker would be handy but would probably take Dick several hours to code... [:-veryhappy-:]



Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 11:58am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



@ Ted -

odor works.......

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 12:07pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm



I know I will most likely catch flak for this post, but I do not think it is a proper thing to do to just erase messages that we all do not agree with. This message board is set up for use of those members that love PT BOATS and can learn and study the History of the boats. Just because we may not agree with each other is no reason to come in and erase a complete section of banter no matter what the content is. As a member here for many years, only now and then do we have a problem where a tiff might break out, but this is a rare thing. Taking ones words or messages out of the message board does not sit well with me at all. I have never even seen anything that bad that needs to be removed. To me, it's like trying to change history. Sorry, but this message board is not always going to have only Brady Bunch banter, but some real life tiffs, that as a rule we always seem to work out. I know my post might not be a popular one, but I hope it won't be removed because someone might not agree with it.............



Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 2:57pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am



You have a point there, Frank. It's tough to know what's right or wrong on something like this. I DO think we would all agree that Dick is an outstanding moderator, though.

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 5:01pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm



Dick is wonderful moderator, and a wonderful guy, I would never question that at all................



Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Dec 5, 2012 - 8:22pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am



Will, I agree whole heartily.
We don't know if he was told to do that or if he was just kind to us by removing nonsense person stuff. If I recall correctly, the posts removed had nothing what so ever to do with PT just personal grips and personal stories of life not the PT. I don't know Dick well, except for here on the board and some very helpful emails and a phone call. I called him about trying to post photos, I was just too dumb to figure it out, but he took the time to walk me through it. After that I found how easy it really was, then again he made all those videos, simply out of concern to help us better post messages about PT boats. And like with me, he use to post photos for me, even under my name and I know he offers it to anyone who needs that done. He and Al join forces to make all those books for us for free on his website page. I like the guy, yet no one comes to his denfense other than Will, everyone seems to be preoccupied about the silly ness of what exact shade of green was PT 109 just prior to sometime in history, as if anyone on this website has any clue to the color!!!! Dick, I don't know if you were ordered to or if you just made the decission your self, any way with me is just fine and thank you very much. Person gripes are not PT history, nothing was lost to history because those posts were removed, I'm sure at least one member if not more are asking for his head.
SH



Posted By: Hadly | Posted on: Dec 6, 2012 - 8:51am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered



I'm sorry for the typo's and bad grammar, I was simply rushing through my lunch time.



Posted By: Hadly | Posted on: Dec 6, 2012 - 8:59am
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered



Hadly, I totally agree with you about Dick. He is a good guy and an excellent moderator, and does a ton of stuff for all of us who visit and post on this website's Message Board.

He deleted some back-and-forth posts I had in the past with a PT veteran who unfortunately decided to insult me about something innocuous I'd said in jest on one of my posts (in defense of the vet, I think he misunderstood me). I trusted Dick's judgement on that then, and still do.

As to the "silliness" you mentioned, well, brother...that's your opinion -- which I don't share. Remember, you don't have to read or comment on posts you think are going to bug you or that indulge in "silliness." A lot of that trivial PT stuff is what fascinates many of us who visit and post here.



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Dec 6, 2012 - 9:14am
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am




Thanks, Will, Frank, Hadly and Drew . . .

I appreciate the sentiment very much, but please it is not necessary. I'm pretty much a big boy although it be old (really old) and can weather the occasional storms.

It was my decision alone to keep the board free of much of the personal conflicts that occur here from time to time. When subject matter changes from PT boat details to other more personal exchanges, they are simply removed. None of the removed posts had anything to do with any PT boat historic data nor did they have additional references to the "Boat".

The decision to remove is not an easy one, and unfortunately many posts can be generated before I find about conflicts or make the final decision. Sometimes I need a ten pound Alka Seltzer dropped on me for indecision! This message board is nearly 13 years old, in one form or another, and I've only removed posts four times.

Please [b]DO NOT[/b] comment any additional on this post, all is well and further discussion on the Non-PT subject is not needed. Please start a new "Topic" if the technical information contained here, needs to be discussed further.

Again, thanks to all, it very much appreciated,
Dick . . .





Posted By: Dick | Posted on: Dec 6, 2012 - 10:30am
Total Posts: 1417 | Joined: Aug 27, 2006 - 6:36pm