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ť Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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ť Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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ť Topic: Italeri PT-109 Test Shots
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=2892

Greetings,
My friends at Italeri sent me some test shot pictures earlier this week. I just got back from vacation and this is my first opportunity to share them with you. Italeri has also posted some additional pictures of their sprue shots and decals on their web site. Give it a look.

The only significant issue that I see with this kit is the armor on the port side of the help interior. I've made Italeri aware of the issue so we'll see if they were able to correct it.

You're going to see some amazing details that they picked up on in this kit thanks to Jeff and Dick. The booklet included is excellent thanks to input from Frank, Gene, and others. I've pointed out some construction errors but keep in mind that this build was just to see if all the parts fit together correctly. For now enjoy the pictures and if you have any feedback please let me know.

Dave
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David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Nov 1, 2012 - 9:31pm
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm

I love the detail on the torpedo tubes. The opened end on the one is a nice touch. Are the torpedo tube transversing cranks on the day cabin roof separate pieces?

I can think of a lot of interesting dioramas showing crews at work on these boats.

Cheers

"Give me a faster PT boat for I'd like to get out of harm's way!"

Posted By: PeterTareBuilder | Posted on: Nov 1, 2012 - 9:42pm
Total Posts: 494 | Joined: Jun 24, 2008 - 5:59pm

Yes, they are separate parts. If you go to Italeri's web site you can see close up pictures of all the sprue, photo etch, decals, etc. Even if we're too late to get a fix on the port side cockpit armor, that's an easy fix.
Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Nov 1, 2012 - 9:55pm
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm

All in All a beautiful kit. In looking at the photo's I could not take issue with anything they have done. I think my only comment would be a bit better detail on the searchlight, but it is no big deal. I love the detail on the torpedoes, and the gun turret's are wonderful. The 20mm gun is spot on. I did not see a life-raft with the kit, in case anyone wished to build her as she left the factory. I am very impressed.

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Nov 1, 2012 - 10:39pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

Wow. Great looking kit. It looks like all the tubes have covers for the torpedoes. Am I seeing that correctly? Looking at it on a very small screen and a little hard to see detail.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 4:41am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

Arg. The flag on the decal sheet.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 4:44am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

Here's a list of the issues I saw. The biggest item was the armor plate on the port side of the cockpit interior. Jeff was kind enough to make a new drawing with details that I sent to Italeri. I hope they get it in time to correct the issue but if not it's an easy fix.

1. Armor plate on port side of cockpit. If they are unable to fix this in time it's an easy fix with some thin sheet styrene. Would love to see this as one brass piece though. We'll see.
2. The handles on the .50 caliber machine guns are on backwards. I suggested they check their instructions.
3. No mount for the bow flagstaff.
4. There should be a wire that runs from the bow light a short distance along the port side of the deck. Same for the stern light. I'm not expecting to see this correction but keep it in mind for your build.
5. There should be wires running from the combustion chambers on the rear of the torpedo tubes to the deck. They run along side the torpedo and then down to the deck near the pivot point. I'm not expecting to see this correction but another reference note.
6. The wing nuts on the torpedo tube breach should be attached to the tube part of the breach and not the door itself. I suggested they check their instructions
7. I'm not sure about the round marks on the corners of the stern of the deck? I believe these are attach points for the deck to the hull. Another easy correction for the modeler.

If you look at the parts you can see that they really paid attention to the drawings provided by Jeff and Dick. So many little details like the mount for the search light on the port side of the helm, the throttle lock on the throttle controls. The frame work on the starboard side of the cockpit. Actually they got it right on the port side but didn't understand how the armor worked (neither did I for that matter. Jeff was very helpful clearing this up). The hinged breach plate was totally unexpected. The ready service lockers have extra 20mm magazines. By the way they've provided two options for the business end of the torpedo tubes. You can go with covers or the wire and triangular plate that we see in some of the photographs. So many details were included. When I get my kit I will do a full review for our site as well as model warships.com.

I didn't expect them to completely redo this kit from the 596 but they did. Again they have more parts that they are working on so maybe a raft will be included. I'm not seeing any stanchions but those could easily be scratch built. Same with the flagstaff mount.

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 5:17am
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm

Oh no! I just had a good look at the decal sheet. It's not good.
1. You're right, they have a modern flag on there. I'll point this out right away.
2. The numbers should not have the black shadow (or whatever that is called). They should be just plane white numbers. They should be smaller on the sides and 20mm than on the chart house too.

Okay, need to get an email off to them right away!

On the up side I did notice a couple of other things. They engraved the planking in the deck which is very cool. They also provide two cockpit bulkheads, one containing a door into the chart house with a window and one a later model without. Very nice option!

Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 5:30am
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm

Good detail list Dave. Nice work.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 6:00am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

Great info, Dave -- thanks, and thanks for all the work you, Al, Jeff, and everyone else has put into this to assist Italeri.

This is a great-looking kit. Remember several years ago, when a lot of us were dreaming, after Italeri put out the 596 kit, that maybe one day they'd put out a 103-class boat?

The detail on the kit is fantastic. Most of the questions I'd have on parts, you've already covered, but here are a few more observations:

-- depth charges are too far forward for the 109, but this is apparently a lost point and cause (of mine)...

-- I don't quite get the need for the photo-etched charthouse-face ports...

-- I don't mind the shaded decal numbers, as we really don't have any (clear) vintage photgraphic evidence of what they looked like on the 109 under JFK. They look like somewhat rounded and unshaded re-paints in the heavily re-touched "JFK & crew on the foredeck" as well as in the "PT 109 on a mission off Guadalcanal" photos, but..? I just hope they're correctly sized for the charthouse/starboard turret/port outboard cockpit/20mm pedestal. And, I wish Italeri would've provided several sets of zero-through-nine numbers, for alternate builds.

-- Kind of wish they'd made (full) torpedo parts for the kit, since the warheads and vanes/propellers will be visible in the fronts and rears of opened tubes...

Still, a beautiful and incredibly detailed kit. I shocked the wife yesterday when I told her I was considering getting a full squadron of the kits..."How many is a squadron?" she asked. After I told her six, I had to pick her up off the floor and tell her I was just kidding... [:-laughing-:]

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 6:45am
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

Drew;
At least you softened the blow and told her a Squadron was 6 boats, what would have happened if you told her the truth....12 Boats! LOL!

David;
As for the numbers, even if they don't fix the decal sheet, Dry transfers at the hobby shop have always worked for me..
windshield detail is OUTSTANDING!! What is wrong with PORT side armor?
Nice touch with opening aft access hatches on torpedo tubes, this brings some diorama ideas up! Also Stbd .50 cal ammo locker...Nice!
items I noticed:
-Supply Duct, STBD side bridge missing....easy fix with scrap plastic.
-Do the supply second navigation horn (later in series PT 139-196, 314-367)? Located between stbd cockpit bulkhead and turret? if not another easy fix
-The wires for the tubes are an easy fix, I made my own for my PT 48 model out of ...wire.
Same type of fix ...Smoke Exhaust Equipment for Mark 6 Generator.
However, this kit looks fantastic, and really what they did leave off or not get right, is fine with me, I always do some kind of kitbashing anyway.
I can't wait to get mine!!!
Take care,
TED

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 8:40am
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

Dave
So glad your eyes are better than most. One question I did have was that , I am pretty positive that the 103 class boats came out of the factory with gun suppressors on the ends of the fifty-mounts. I do not see any with the photos you posted. I guess we could stare at the boat all day long and find certain things wrong. Still a great kit.

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 8:43am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

Ted,

I must have been thinking of those early, Tulagi-era partial squadrons when I told the wife about "six boats." You're right -- she really would have run screaming if she thought I wanted to display twelve of these big models in our little (to quote Jerry Lewis) "ranch-type-style-tract-house!"

In answer to your question "what's wrong with the port side armor?" I'd previously mentioned that I noticed, on the CAD drawings of the model, that the inboard port side cockpit bulkhead showed open framing like the starboard side -- which was incorrect. As Dave mentioned, if the kit does have this (incorrect) framing, it would be an easy fix to sand it off or cover it with sheet plastic.

Frank, you're also right about those missing tubular flash hiders on the ends of the .50 caliber's barrels -- didn't catch that at first. Maybe they're still in the kit, as there's a photo of a PT turret's twin .50's in the kit's Photo Reference Manual which show those very type of flash hiders? Hope so, as the 109 most definitely had those on her .50's.

Happy to see the searchlight pintle mount, and lots of other great details. What a great scale model rendition of this iconic PT. I hope Italeri sells a ton of them -- they've done a great job.

Now -- for a 12 (or 13 -- remember Barney Ross) -figure crew for the boat! But I'm putting the cart before the horse again.

Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 3:51pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am

Lots of questions. I still have some myself.

Horn - I can't tell if one has been supplied for the starboard side of the chart house. But did you know there's one on the support brace for the 20mm depression rail? I didn't until Jeff posted his drawings and Italeri has included it in their kit.

Torpedo - Great point about being able to see the torpedo in back of the tube with the breach open. I'm not sure if this is included or not.

Flash Suppressers - I don't see them and not sure if they are included. But I am writing Piotr at Master Model to see if he's going to machine barrels for this set like he did for the 596 which were superb!

Decals - Yep, the flag and the numbers aren't going to work. But if we're too late to get that fixed they are easy to source in the after market world. As far as the numbers go. The 109 was repainted in the field. I am 100% confident that the numbers were hand painted. The numbers have the 45 degree angle but just like the aircraft in theatre they hand painted the numbers. Kenny Loop at Gators Grip will be happy to make some masks for anyone interested.

As I learn more I'll be happy to share it with you. This is the kit I've dreamed about since I was a kid. I can't wait!

Dave

David Waples

Posted By: David Waples | Posted on: Nov 2, 2012 - 9:12pm
Total Posts: 1679 | Joined: Jan 2, 2007 - 9:55pm