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ť Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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ť Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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ť Topic: LATE SQUADRONS CAMO
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=2835

ALL;

I recieved my first PT 596 model, and some questions have come to light.

RON 38-41 did they use black as the third color in their Measure 31/20L, or was it supplemented with a darker green, as with earlier Squadrons that adopted this scheme later?

Some of the "596" models I have seen on line, appear to have a nasty O.D. green shade as base color, is this correct? Also was the base color of this camo like O.D./light chromate green or darker? FYI: I am mixing my own paint not going the WEM route.
Take care,
TED

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Sep 13, 2012 - 6:37pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

I've never heard of the black in MS31/20L being replaced with a green. From what source did this come?

When first conceived, 31/20L for 80' ELCOs used Ocean Green (5-O), Navy Green (5-NG), and black for vertical surfaces, Deck Green (20-G) for horizontl surfaces. By 1945, 5-O and 5-NG were replaced (respectively) with Green 2 and Green 3. The earlier greens were pure greens, while the later ones were yellow greens.

This is a scan of the later greens. The colors on your screen will not perfectly match the chips, but should give you an idea of their general shades. [IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/green.jpg[/IMaGe] You could also just buy a tin of each color from WEM and use them as a reference.

Al

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Sep 13, 2012 - 8:04pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

Ted, when Stan did my PT-596, we used GREEN #1 and #2. I never saw black on one..........

Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Sep 14, 2012 - 11:10am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am

Curiously, MS31/20L comprised a number of patterns. I have drawings for at least five. However, based on photographic evidence, they seem to have standardized on this particular pattern:
[IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/596c_0001.jpg[/IMaGe]
[IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/596c_0002.jpg[/IMaGe]
If you look at the photos of 596 in Vic's volume 1, you'll see that she carries this pattern.

The same pattern applied (with the exception of the deck pattern) to Higgins boats, as well.
[IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/120562502.jpg[/IMaGe]
Here, a RON23 boat, which was originally painted in MS31/5P, displays the standardized MS31/20L pattern
[IMaGe]http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i204/alross2/Ron23-005.jpg[/IMaGe]
Al

Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Sep 14, 2012 - 2:24pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm

Then . . . .

There is this one MS31-20L:

[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Webmaster/MS31-20L.gif[/image]

Posted By: Dick | Posted on: Sep 14, 2012 - 2:36pm
Total Posts: 1417 | Joined: Aug 27, 2006 - 6:36pm

Al, Frank, and Dick;
I have these scheme plates too also (actually I have all of them including the un used or rejected schemes).
I know the pattern calls for black, but, I was speaking of the black, that when fading(on some "artist" renderings) appears to look more like a color similar to the German dunklegraun,
I got this plate off the intenet.
black to the boat.....I am tracking now.
Take care,
TED

[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Ted%20Walther/measure31-20L.jpg[/image]

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Sep 14, 2012 - 3:17pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

Gents;
I finally decided on which boats I am doing for my Miami Shakedown 1945. Both from RON 40, PT 599 KATCHA MARU(LT Rumsey Ewing CO) and I am sticking with PT 596 HELL RAZOR.......Does anyone have a crews list for this boat????.
This way all I have to do is flip the 6 and repaint the shadowing.

Does anyone have any photos of PT 599? I only have a crew photo in Miami.
Thanks,
TED

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Sep 15, 2012 - 8:13pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

Hi Ted,
One of our original crewmen on PT658, the late Bob Hostetter was XO on PT596 of RON40. I scanned his photos that I obtained from CAPT Harry Weidmaeir after he passed away and these names were written on the back of this crew photo, Bob was also on two other PT Boats in RON25 PT348 and PT350 so these may be the crews of one of those 2 other boats vice the 596 boat. But i have no way of telling which boat this crew belonged to! I hope this is somewhat helpful. Also I included some pics of 3 different RON43 boats wearing camo Measure 31-20L pattern PT625, 628 and PT631. Plus the best boat of all time PT658. Jerry PT658 Portland

[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/PT596crewbackhunterunkrhawleybalishcettispirogmartellischonemazbettenkorthoughmcmahonfrontrowyourstrulycoxo.jpg[/image]

Crew names written on back of photo:
Back row: Hunter,unk,RHawley,Balish,Cetti,Spirog,Martelli,Schoneman,
Bettenkort,Hough,McMahon
Front row: Yours truly,CO,XO

PT631 in camo 31-20L
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/PT631Higgins006.jpg[/image]

PT628 in camo
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/PT628camo.jpg[/image]

PT625 in 31-20L pattern

[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/PT625BillSkadeNewOrleanscloseup.jpg[/image]

PT658 in June 2011
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/PT658/PT658paintrev1.jpg[/image]

Jerry Gilmartin

Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Sep 15, 2012 - 10:11pm
Total Posts: 1472 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm

Jerry;
Thanks. PT 596 it is for Bob Hostetter.
As for PT 599(KATCHA MARU)I have a photo that was in Summer 1997 PT Boater,
PT 599 crew in August 1945 at Miami (* Denotes these men were also crewmembers of PT 191 RON 12, when Ewing was Skipper of that boat):
LT. Rumsey Ewing- Skipper*
ENS Bob Cross- Exec
Wharton
Leo Darr
Harry Klug
Jerry Goldberg
John Brevard
Tom Ratcliff
"Buzz" Barton
Fogg
Hopkins
Gust
Petersen*
Snyder*
No rates and first names as of yet. A look at the log books should clear this up.
I like what you did with the model of PT 596, making it a tribute to Bob Hostetter. It has given me some ideas for my project. What are the names that were on the back of that photo of the crew, a look at PT 596's log books will also clear this up. Jerry email me at LTWALTHER2@aol.com
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Ted%20Walther/JerrysmodelforBobHostetterRON40.jpg[/image]

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Sep 16, 2012 - 6:20pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

Jerry;
I wrote too soon!!! oops Sorry.
As I said in previous post, a look at the logbooks for PT 596 will tell us if this is that crew or of RON25 PT348 and PT350.
Thanks again,
TED

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Sep 16, 2012 - 6:27pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am