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ť Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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ť Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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ť Topic: Torpedo Colors ??
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=1983

Before I get too, far I'd like to ask about torpedo warhead and engine shell colors.

Here, I have some pale and light green, black, off-white, and red warheads with either steel or bronze colored engine seciton shells.

Am I close? Am I way, off?

Were there any other colors that I should consider? Blues? Yellows?

Keep in mind I'm depicting Ron 33 in November 1944 at Leyte Gulf.

[image]http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii194/carlomaha/Model%20-%20PT%20Boats/P1130134.jpg[/image]

Posted By: Carl M | Posted on: Oct 28, 2010 - 12:30pm
Total Posts: 79 | Joined: Jan 12, 2010 - 1:15pm

I have seen photos of them painted in camo colors and patterns like the boats. Also,the bodies were metal and often covered with a grease or shellac to protect from the elements and reduce their reflection. The grease or shellac looked like it has something mixed in that was dark, maybe black. The warheads were bronze I think and painted. Some colors, like I think yellow were for practice warheads. I think medium to dark greys, black, and even some of the darker green colors would be hard to disprove as being possible. I know I've seen some artwork depicting red warheads but I'm sure about them. With the boats operating at night, I suspect anything that reflected light or was too easy to see at night or reflected sunlight during the day was probably not used.

Jerry has a good color photo of a torpedo used on their great restoration that shows the tinted shellac coating on the body.

On my 495 build I painted the bodies silver then streaked them with a black wash and overcoated them with a pail yellow clearcoat to hint of varnish, shellac or gease. The warheads i paint a couple shades of green or grey. White and red looked out of place to me. Black might be possible but I figured it would have faded to a dark grey anyway.

At this of the war most action was against barges so only the forward fish were carried to save weight. When I depicted the Battle of Surigao Strait the boats were expecting surface action against warships and carried 4. I made the aft torpedoes look "fresher" than the forward ones.
Hope this helps. not actually being there puts me at a disadvantage and if I'm wrong i hope someone jumps in and corrects me so as not to spread false information.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Oct 28, 2010 - 1:17pm
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

Hi Carl,
Ed colored his torpedoes the most authentic way in my humble opinion. The PT boat Torpedomen smeared/brushed on sort of a thinned out brownish cosmoline onto the outside of the bare grey steel afterbodies, and had to do this fairly often to prevent the afterbodies from rusting in the salt air. I have seen photos of a lot of the warheads that are painted sort of a primer grey color. The torpedoes on a tender were stored in two parts, the warheads separate from the afterbodies. Then they would bring them up from below and assemble the warhead to the afterbody. I think the torpedo depot on a lot of the bases would keep these parts separate. Frank Andruss sells a PT Boat Movie that shows the crew of a PT Tender assembling and loading a torpedo onto a nested PT Boat. In the color movie, it shows the dull grey steel afterbody and the primer colored warhead. Here in this picture, you can see the color of the torpedo taken at an Alaska Naval Air Facility of a Mark 13 torpedo. I have read and heard that some of the PT Boats at the front lines may have actually painted the torpedoes to match the camo pattern on the boat. I guess it depended upon the boat crew and boat captain. I think CJ was a TM so he would be able to shed some light on this as well. Jerry PT658 Portland

Mark 13 torpedo warhead painted primer grey at Alaska NAS
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/mk13torpedocolor-2.jpg[/image]

Jerry Gilmartin

Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Oct 28, 2010 - 7:40pm
Total Posts: 1473 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/4351010758-PTBoatTorpedo.jpeg[/image]

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/YYVWG-10645372-DSCF0009.JPG[/image]

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/QLRHK-60996479-DSCF0004.JPG[/image]

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/51645699-DSCF0017edit1.jpg[/image]

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/56174920-DSCF0016edit1.jpg[/image]

The lighting reduced the yellow tint somewhat. I used future floor polish with a little bit of yellow fd coloring in it. The more coats you apply the more solid it gets. I used it to paint the props on the fish too.

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 5:11am
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

I have at least one photo of an Elco with the cammo carried over to the fish themselves.

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 11:47am
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Sorry for the poor quality. The original is better than this scan turned out. Here is a boat leaving Elco. If you look closely you can see the top of the torpedoes, including warheads, are painted the dark cammo shade and the bottom seems to be the lighter shade of the colors used on the boat. The very bottom is shadow so don't let that confuse you.

[image]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2002-11/65524/315_0001_1_1.jpg[/image]

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 3:33pm
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

It looks like the cammo pattern (PTs 171, 192) were on the warheads only, not the entire fish.

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 4:53pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

what boat is thatin the color photo??? I have never seen this one before. Can you do a larger scan of this photo?
take care,
TED

Posted By: TED WALTHER | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 6:58pm
Total Posts: 3059 | Joined: Oct 16, 2006 - 7:42am

Im with Ted on that one [:-happy2-:] A bigger scan please

Posted By: AndrewB | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 7:38pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

Ted,
I just sent you an e-mail with the jpg attached. It is all i have.
Ed

Posted By: ducati650 | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 8:17pm
Total Posts: 450 | Joined: Feb 19, 2007 - 10:01am

I'm not so sure, guys. I ran this shot through a couple of edit programs and I think maybe the torps are silver but getting reflected light off the water. Or maybe not....

Will

Posted By: Will Day | Posted on: Oct 29, 2010 - 10:47pm
Total Posts: 1955 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 4:19pm

Thank you, everyone, for posting your replies. I have gotten rid of the red warheads and will stick to mostly grayish warheads.

You've all been very, helpful!

Posted By: Carl M | Posted on: Oct 30, 2010 - 4:20am
Total Posts: 79 | Joined: Jan 12, 2010 - 1:15pm

Hi Ducati650
Can you please do me a big favor and measure height of the radar mast from the roof of the cabin to the top of the radar dome on your PT495 model ? cheers and thanks
Andrew

Posted By: AndrewB | Posted on: Oct 30, 2010 - 2:40pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

Oh Ducati and the scale of your model [:-bigeyes-:]

Posted By: AndrewB | Posted on: Oct 30, 2010 - 3:02pm
Total Posts: | Joined: Unregistered

Hey Carl,
I know it may be too late to make any difference but for what its worth, last week I was wire wheeling and refurbishing one of our Mark 13 PT Boat torpedoes and I took a few pictures to show you the real color of the bare torpedoes. (Unpainted) I found out by researching them that the warheads were made of plain sheet steel and then Cadmium plated. Cadmium is a greyish metal a lot like Zinc. It looks like a very thin coating that you can remove by persistant wire wheeling or polishing. (But why would you want to?) Anyway here are some pictures I took so you can see the true colors of the steel torpedos. I dont think they bothered to paint the warheads primer grey, that was just the natural Cadmium color. Jerry

Warhead and air flask showing colors
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01859.jpg[/image]

Up close bare warhead shows color of cadmium plate
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01860.jpg[/image]

The whole torpedo sitting on a trailer
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01863.jpg[/image]

The crew Ray and Tom hard at work on refurbishing the torpedo
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01840.jpg[/image]

Another view
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01867.jpg[/image]

Close up of tail fins all shined up
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01866.jpg[/image]

Our other cutaway already color coded and lableled
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01736.jpg[/image]

The back of the color coded torpedo shows engine
[image]http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p249/ptboats/Jerry%20Gilmartin/DSC01735.jpg[/image]

I hope this is of some value to see these pics. Jerry PT658 Portland OR

Jerry Gilmartin

Posted By: Jerry Gilmartin | Posted on: Nov 7, 2010 - 3:37pm
Total Posts: 1473 | Joined: Oct 8, 2006 - 11:16pm