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» Forum Category: PT Boats of WWII
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» Forum Name: PT Boats - General
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» Topic: Another question for Al Ross re 80' Elco antenna sections
http://www.ptboatforum.com/cgi-bin/MB2/netboardr.cgi?cid=101&fid=102&tid=1381



Dr. Ross,

Do you know what the lengths of the (two?) sections of the telescoping radio antennae on the 80' Elcos -- the lower and upper sections -- were?



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Jun 5, 2009 - 11:10am
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



Drew,

The ELCO parts manual states only that they are government furnished (catalog #MM-435X) and that they are interchangable with the rigid type (also government furnished). The TechSpecs manual for the 565 series doesn't give any lengths or much other radio-related info either.

Al



Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Jun 5, 2009 - 1:22pm
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm



Thanks, Al.



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Jun 6, 2009 - 7:12am
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



You might want to try contacting these people Drew:

[url]http://www.premaxlp.com/about/history.html[/url]

A link on that page opens a 1944 "thank you" telegram from Rear Admiral Cochrane.

I had also found this ad:
Premax 1PG Antenna base for marine & naval HF Whip Antenna
This is a heavy duty antenna base for marine antenna applications. Premax made the whip antennas that were used with TCS radio Sets used on the WW 2 PT boats. This may be one of them.
This is a are rare item. They are now made by .A. Miller.
Condition: good used, $75.00
Shipping Weight: 10 Lb.




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Jun 6, 2009 - 6:43pm
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



I don't know if it has the PT antenna but a 1947 Premax manual is for sale:

[url]http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Premax-Antenna-Manual-1947-Police-Marine-Mobil_W0QQitemZ200201056814QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2e9ce9b22e&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116[/url]




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Jun 6, 2009 - 7:06pm
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



Drew

Although I can't remember where I saw this information, I recall the lenth to be somewhere between 12 and 18 feet fully extended. I am looking in my files for this and hope to locate this. I have nothing in my Elco files as to the lenth.



Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Jun 7, 2009 - 3:56am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am



Found this at [url]http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ref/PT-Manual/MTBM-4.html#C6[/url]:

Motor Torpedo Boat Manual
February 1943

Name.--Navy Model TCS radio telephone and telegraph transmitter and receiver.
Frequency range.--1. 5-12. 0 megacycles (1,500-12,000 kilocycles).
Output.--40 watts Key/CW; 20 watts voice.
Power supply.--Two dynamotors.
Antenna.--Whip type--20-foot vertical.




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Jun 8, 2009 - 4:21pm
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



Here's one of the best images of the section joints I've seen, taken at Melville:

[image]http://www.pt103.com/images/ptpics/8e01469u_Antenna.jpg[/image]




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Jun 9, 2009 - 12:20am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



From my pictures it appears that they were three section antennas. The picture posted by Jeff D. appears to be of a collapsed antenna with both 'collars' next to each other. I've cropped some pisctures of Ron 27 boats and left them somewhat large to hopefully retain details. The 'collars' don't have the small ring at the bottom of them as in Jeff's picture. The first section is slightly higher than the searchligt, about the same height as the short antenna (don't know its real name) aft of the searchlight. The second collar appears to be slightly higher then the top of the radome. A full height antenna is visible among the nested boats. In the last picture of the 361 the base of the antenna is obscured by a tarp canopy on the foredeck, but you can see the antenna joints relative heights. The monkey was named Tojo or Little Joe, later determined to be Josephine.

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/Antenna1.jpg[/image]

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/Antenna2.jpg[/image]

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/antenna3.jpg[/image]

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/antenna4.jpg[/image]

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/Antenna5.jpg[/image]

[image]http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o102/prjm3/Antenna6.jpg[/image]

Randy McConnell (Randall J. McConnell III)

Posted By: PRJM3 | Posted on: Jun 9, 2009 - 4:33pm
Total Posts: 94 | Joined: May 25, 2009 - 2:47pm



Thanks for the info and photos, Jeff and Randy...



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Jun 9, 2009 - 5:06pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



I found out they were manufactured by Premax, and that the company still existed, I sent an email to their customer service requesting any information on their World War II antenna products.

Richard Hannah, the General Manager of Premax, was nice enough to sent me a PDF of their twelve-page 1945 catalog, which contains a marine section on "Monel Antennas" (page seven), "developed especially for Navy use." My best guess is that the PT antennas (at least for the 80' Elcos) were the "USM-325 3-section jointed" antennas, which had an extended length of 25 feet and a collapsed length of 9 feet. Please see the link and photo below:

Drew Cook

CLICK the link to view/download the complete pdf file: [url]http://www.ptboatforum.com/PTFdocuments/AntennaCatalogR42.pdf[/url]

View of the Monel Antennas page:

AntennaCatalogR42small-7.jpg



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Dec 17, 2009 - 5:32pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



Thanks Drew, there's great information on various antenna dimensions in the brochure.




Posted By: Jeff D | Posted on: Dec 18, 2009 - 2:37am
Total Posts: 2200 | Joined: Dec 21, 2006 - 1:30am



Nice tidbit, Drew. Every little bit helps to further our understanding of the boats.

Al



Posted By: alross2 | Posted on: Dec 18, 2009 - 5:53am
Total Posts: 993 | Joined: Oct 30, 2006 - 8:19pm



Great find Drew. You can never know everything about these little boats, but with articles like that, it sure helps............



Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Dec 18, 2009 - 6:54am
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am



My pleasure, guys.

Again, the catalog is courtesy of Richard Hannah, GM of the present-day Premax, and our intrepid webmaster Dick Washichek, who put it up on the Message Board for us.



Posted By: Drew Cook | Posted on: Dec 18, 2009 - 12:56pm
Total Posts: 1306 | Joined: Oct 19, 2006 - 10:44am



As always Dick, thanks for all that you do for us here on the message board. If there was one award for "The Person who displays kindness to so many" you would get my vote..............



Posted By: Frank J Andruss Sr | Posted on: Dec 18, 2009 - 2:15pm
Total Posts: 3497 | Joined: Oct 9, 2006 - 6:09am