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 Author  Topic: PT 486 Oct-Nov 1944
Andy Small

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Andy Small  Posted on: Sep 29, 2016 - 8:10pm
Also project Campbell/Javeman was ongoing at this time in Little Creek. In addition to the Hacker-Craft they had an 85 footer fitted out for remote control, but maybe they toyed around with using an ELCO as a remote control explosive. Just don't know, but the time frame sort of matches with this OSS project. Need to see what's in the BUSHIPS record.


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Andy Small

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Andy Small  Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 5:03am
For those not familiar with this OSS project, one of the key items of the plan was to take out the newly completed Kanmon railway tunnel connecting Kyushu and Honshu using remotely controlled boats. The boats would be scuttled on top of the tunnel, sunk and then large charges detonated. Other than the photos and timing, my thoughts are that they were looking to come up with a modification they could produce locally. Then they could take piles of the worn out PTs in the Pacific theater and modify them for remote use as weapons for use at the end of the war.


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Jimbo Melanson

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 5:43am
thx Ted. Interesting stuff! Always something to learn and think about here. I love the 486. Always hoping to win the lottery!! HA!

Jimbo

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  TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 9:05am
Andy;
Using old worn out LCPL's is what killed the Stingray Project. What was this OSS project called? The one to blow the Kanmon Railway Tunnel in Kyushu.
TED



P.S. I found a link with some additional info; It looks like the Operation was originally given to the 20th Air Force,(Mother Ship) they were supposed to bomb it in July-_Aug 1945, with USAAF 85' ASR boats disguised as fishing sampans.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=196841&start=45

Here is a gem: file:///C:/Users/home/Downloads/2984.pdf

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Andy Small

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Andy Small  Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 2:34pm
Ted, This was the OSS project that followed Stingray/Apex and was considered part first Project Campbell and then Javaman (according to H.R Everett's book - Unmanned Systems of World War I and II). Project Campbell was the project that sank the SS San Pablo in the Gulf of Mexico in August 1944.

I had read about this all a couple months ago and that's why I was so interested in these photos of an empty boat, steel and wood internal cribbing, pig iron and concrete ballast and detonators since it sounded awfully similar to the Hacker-Craft project that were on-going in Little Creek in 1944. For the anti-boat version of the project (SS San Pablo test), two holding pins fired into the hull on impact and initiated the scuttling of the boat by blowing off the bow and stern. A steel cable swung the 14 depth charges kept together by a steel frame against the hull and then a big BANG!. Vessel obliterated. The Navy supposedly shot this down as too dangerous although they thought it ingenious. Project then became Javaman and shifted to the Kanmon Railway Tunnel project. This was briefed and approved by MacArthur. Boats (non-PT) were in theater at the end of the war.

Again, the timing and setup all seems to fit. But, then again I could be terribly wrong. Been there, done that....


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TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 3:07pm
Andy;
Here is a Pearl I just found, check it out:file:///C:/Users/home/Downloads/2984.pdf
TED


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Andy Small

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Andy Small  Posted on: Sep 30, 2016 - 7:44pm
Outstanding! Just spent a good hour reading and downloading all the great info. Especially like this particular video:

Campbell Missile against SS San Pablo



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mcgovern61

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Oct 7, 2016 - 1:49pm
I can tell you that wood and steel cribbing was not on the boat in 1979. I worked on the Big Blue Sightseer from 1979 through 1983 and lived onboard during the operating season. What a great boat! The 486 is currently undercover in Kingston New York.

I always wondered why the boat was sold without engines to George Sinn. Otto Stocker put in the 1st set of engines and eventually she ended up with two Detroit Diesel 12V71's with 2.5:1 Capitol gears. The engines were not installed aft like most 80' Elco's. Stocker installed them midship. The original Sentron seals were still there (and functioning) for all three shafts even though the boat only has two engines now.

Gerry

Former crew member of the Big Blue Sightseer ex-PT 486

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Andy Small

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Andy Small  Posted on: Jul 28, 2019 - 4:40pm
An update. The boat is Elco hull #3683 and was Small Boat Designation C-36204. This hull was a contract modification and the hull never had an assigned PT Boat number. This past week while at NARA I verified C-36204 was not part of the OSS Project Campbell/Javaman but did learn of a Navy "Project Stinger", which was a project from the beginning to end of 1944, so the dates match up. I believe C-36204 was part of this Navy project. Also learned that 2 PT Boats were converted to radio and television control and operated out of Brooklyn Navy Yard in the June-July 44 timeframe. I have no numbers associated, but would imagine that they might have been Ron 4 boats, since I know others were sent South to NY for temporary assignments and projects.


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Arjan Wiskerke

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Arjan Wiskerke  Posted on: Jul 29, 2019 - 2:08am
Since PT 557 is also mentioned in this thread I would like to pose a question about this vessel. What was the function of the braces at the top of the hull ? Perhaps they were an addition to the standard rubbing strakes to protect the hull from impacts ?




Arjan


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