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 Author  Topic: Another early 80' Elco question
Dick

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Dick   Send Email To Dick Posted on: May 18, 2011 - 1:55pm

Al is right.

Although Elco labels the part as "Windshield" windscreen or deflector might be more accurate terms for its intended purpose. It is labeled as 3/8" Plywood.

Dick . . .




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Will Day

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Will Day   Send Email To Will Day Posted on: May 18, 2011 - 2:56pm

So Jerry, you're sticking to your assertion that all Elco officers conned their boats crouched down behind the aft wall of the dayroom?

Will

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TGConnelly

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: May 18, 2011 - 3:09pm
Dick,

I apologize for being incorrect ...

BUT ...

In action, don't you tend - logically - to think that an enterprising crew might want to add a litle more protection? IN SPITE of what a manual or a reg calls for?

Think about it, you're in close-quarters combat - you're going to put your life behind a sheet of plywood?

THAT is not logical sir.

They put STS on the PTGBs - therefore - it is quite logical to assume and make a jump to the conclusion that SOME PT boats might have replaced the windshield with STS.

That's ALL I will say ...

Garth



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Dick

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Dick   Send Email To Dick Posted on: May 18, 2011 - 10:50pm
Lets not get testy here! ! ! !

No one spouted out you were incorrect. It was only noted that Al's comment was correct because all the engineering drawing validated the aft windshield was fabricated out of 3/8" plywood, as were the two side spry shields.

We were talking about the design nature of the Elco 80' boat, not speculating what or would have been modified or altered by a crew, a squadron or even the Commissioning Unit.

If I wanted to better protect members of the crew and key areas, I wouldn't armor a 3-foot aft windscreen if I left the entire Dayroom as a thin plywood veneer. It would surely be at the very least the machine gun turrets, radio room (Chart House), maybe protect other gun positions with Splinter shields.

It’s always easy to speculate, but near impossible to prove, if it isn't documented or designed into the drawings. With my very limited knowledge of PT boats, I've always been lead to believe these boat were fast and swift, not armored tugs.

Dick . . .




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Frank J Andruss Sr

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Frank J Andruss Sr   Send Email To Frank J Andruss Sr Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 4:16am
Not sure why you would even think about putting any protection in this area in the first place. This was just a device to deflect wind and really nothing more. PT BOATS were built for speed and manuverablity, so any added weight was a real NO NO (at least before the boats became gun platforms) so not sure why your would think this Garth..............


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David Waples

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of David Waples  Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 4:48am
Hi Greg,
When I did my 109 model I ended up removing the molded in spray shield and then used plastic stock to fill in the hole that doesn't belong on the top of the day cabin. Once I smoothed it to shape and restored the detail I created a new spray shield from thin plastic stock and glued it into place. Keep in mind the turret ring that needs to be installed when replacing this shield.

Then there are the two spray shields that attach to the engine compartment hatch and are braced to the day cabin gun turret and the day cabin. I have no idea how these attached in reality. Keep in mind that that engine hatch has to come off from time to time so I'm sure the spray shields were installed with that in mind. The starboard spray shield extends back from the the small spray shield attached to the top of the day cabin that we've been talking about. This part of the boat isn't well photographed.

One thing to keep in mind is that the Revell kit is missing a window on the aft end of the day cabin just outside the large starboard engine hatch spray shield. I'm not sure how carried away you want to get with this detail. The windows as molded on the day cabin are incorrect anyway. The kit has these crazy little shades over them that never existed on the real boat. I removed them and repaired the area around the window with plastic stock to make it look more like the prototype.

If I can be of additional help please let me know. Enjoy your build!
Dave

David Waples

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David Waples

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of David Waples  Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 5:01am
To add to what Frank is saying it is more often the case that parts were removed. For example Mr. Keresey, skipper of PT-105 writes about how they removed the surround panel behind the helm on the 105 boat to reduce weight. They erroneously thought that they had a weight problem when in reality they had a prop problem. But they never replaced the shield. This was also confirmed to me by Mr. Iles who had the boat with and after Mr. Keresey. There are many examples of this feature removed from the boats.

There's a great photo of the 115 boat in both Johnson's and Chun's book that shows the spray shields attached to the engine hatch removed completely. However the left the portion that was attached to the day cabin in place.

Dave



David Waples

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alross2

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of alross2   Send Email To alross2 Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 1:55pm
Quote:

Then there are the two spray shields that attach to the engine compartment hatch and are braced to the day cabin gun turret and the day cabin. I have no idea how these attached in reality.



Cropped from ELCO reel 1, image 432:





The side panels were simply through bolted or riveted (the image is poor) to cleats (wood strips) which, in turn, were screwed to the hatch, turret, and day cabin aft bulkhead.

Al Ross


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GregB

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of GregB  Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 6:09pm
David,

I'm planning to go basically the same route that you did on this area. Your PT-109 is
providing me many ideas.

I would ask you one question. I have the WEM detail set, but I don't like the handholds. Yours look much better. Would you mind telling me what you used?


Al,

Thanks for the pictures and answers.


GregB





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Jeff D

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Jeff D   Send Email To Jeff D Posted on: May 19, 2011 - 7:02pm
Here's a shot of the area sans the after windshield:

http://pt127.org/crew/douglas_rj/photos/pages/Deck2_tif.htm



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