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Topic: Higgin´s Boat in Argentina - Ushuaia January 2014 |
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Bob
MASTER
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Posted on: Jan 19, 2014 - 6:38am
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We have definately tried all of the static displays, with no luck. We cant have a mold made from an existing unit because bronze shrinks 2%. So a pattern has to be made 2% larger.
Jerry, whatever happened to the 659's ports?
Bob |
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PeterTareBuilder2
MASTER
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Posted on: Jan 19, 2014 - 8:38am
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Quote:
We have definately tried all of the static displays, with no luck. We cant have a mold made from an existing unit because bronze shrinks 2%. So a pattern has to be made 2% larger.
Jerry, whatever happened to the 659's ports?
Bob
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Ahoy there.
Could you not add a removable material to the existing part to make it the needed 2% larger?
Cheers
"Give me a fast boat for we want to get out of harm's way too." |
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Bob
MASTER
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Posted on: Jan 19, 2014 - 8:45am
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We will either have one made or make one ourselves at this point.
Bob |
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Jerry Gilmartin |
TOP BOSS
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 Posted on: Jan 19, 2014 - 11:00am
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Bob,
As far as I can recall, I never remember seeing the ports on the 659, even when it was first aquired from Pt Mugu back in 1989. I have seen photos from those days and I think they had already been removed by the time the boat was moved up to Oregon. I will check further. I also wonder what happened to the ports from the ex-PT657, which is now located in San Diego and called Malahini. It was repowered by two Yanmar Diesels and the ports are no longer installed. I will let you know if I can find out what happened to PT659 ports.
Take care, Jerry
Jerry Gilmartin
PT658 Crewman
Portland OR |
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Wayne Traxel
MASTER
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Posted on: Jan 19, 2014 - 9:05pm
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Hi Jerry's right about no mufflers on PT659. A friend, Duane Fose took these photos of this Higgins at the National Guard base, Oregon in 1991.
Wayne |
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David Buck
TOP BOSS
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Posted on: Jan 21, 2014 - 4:07am
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Hi Bob,
This may be thinking a little left of centre but At Close Quarters lists PT200 as having been sunk off Newport R.I in 1944, just wondering if what's left of her is still there and if she might be at a depth that could be reached by divers?
As such she may already have been salvaged but you may be able to find that out by asking some of the local Dive Shops or Groups. There also may be someone on this board that is close to the area that may know a little more or could find out for you. Depth and location would be the main information needed.
Knowing the Diving groups that I go out with when approached with something like this are only to keen to help, you may find the same there.
Something to think about anyway.
As far as building the part 2% bigger for molding what seems to be the problem?
I know making parts that you do not have "one in your hands" to get the feel from is very hard and adding extra is in knowing where to add if you follow, do you have the drawing with ALL the measurements, if not and this is what is holding you up, then I would strongly suggest that Jerry and his hardworking team would assist in any way possible.
Hope some of this is helpfull
Yours,
D.buck |
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Jerry Gilmartin |
TOP BOSS
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Posted on: Jan 21, 2014 - 10:45am
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Hey David,
From talking to the folks in New Orleans, I think they already have ot least one of the mufflers. They (Jerry Strahan I think?) obtained them from what was left of PT308 up in Delaware when the property owner had the boat bulldozed. They were able to recover 4 or 5 out of 6 total, but they never found the one that was probably buried 20 feet under the mud. The Navy even used their sidescan sonar to try and locate it. Anyway, my point is, they already have an example of what they need to cast. I am not sure I understand howe the casting process works, but that may not be insurmountable. I hope the PT Boat Gods smile upon the National WW2 Museum and supply them with one more muffler casting!
Jerry
Jerry Gilmartin
PT658 Crewman
Portland OR |
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29navy
TOP BOSS
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Posted on: Jan 21, 2014 - 11:45am
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PT-200 was raised shortly after she sunk. She was returned to MTBSTC and surveyed as a total loss.
Charlie |
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TED WALTHER |
TOP BOSS
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Posted on: Jan 21, 2014 - 2:03pm
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Wow!
David, Now that is really reaching, while I am thinking about it, there probably is a complete set still in Lambu Lambu cove.(PT 239).
Jerry,
That part from PT 308 is probably still in the mud at Dagsboro, remembering Franklin Timmons place, from when I climbed aboard 308,aside from the 5 foot wide area of beach at low tide, it was straight up marsh mud! and from what I know about side scan, if you don't hit it, you don't find it. That's why a few shotguns, one M-16, and one M-60E are still in the Panama Canal.
Since nobody is coughing up an existing one, Casting a new one is the fastest solution for the 305 group, lets hope they get one soon.
Take care,
TED
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David Buck
TOP BOSS
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Posted on: Jan 22, 2014 - 1:30am
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Hi Ted, Charlie, and Jerry,
Ted not such a reach as a certain Australian not so long ago visited many South Pacific WW11 aircraft wrecks left on the airfields built on the Islands and returned with enough of them to set himself up for life from the sale of about 70% of them, many to overseas buyers!
Many of these wrecks would have disappeared into the jungle and never have been seen again.
Charlie, shame that she is not there but this highlights what this board can do, thanks for letting us know (saves going looking but that could have been a board first?)
Jerry, Sooo "The plot thickens" If they have a few examples then that will make it a little easier to built a form for casting.
OK Casting,
To start you need two boxes of equal size that the top and bottom can be removed from,
With the top you take what you want to cast (Say a cylinder) build half of it onto one side of the box with a little extra size to allow for shrinkage, this is called a form
Then fit the top with the form facing into the box to the box with pins so that it can be lifted off but not move while on the box,
Place the box on a table with the form at the bottom and the open end on top,
Next you fill the box with sand that is a little damp and has a light release agent mixed through it making sure that it packs in around the form without any voids
Fill the box to the top and secure the bottom of the box so that the sand will not fall out,
Turn box over,
Carefully remove the form from the top of the box, you now have a box full of sand that has the shape of the item (in this case a cylinder ) in it. This is known as a half mould.
Repeat process for box two,
You now have two boxes that have our form in them .
At this point a funnel needs to be made through the sand from the outside of the box (which at this point has a cut out to allow this) to the cylinder at one end to allow the metal to enter and an extra hole (vent) to allow the air within the shape to escape during pouring, these can be made in one or both boxes.
Using pins on their faces to line the boxes up carefully place the two boxes together and secure then together so that they do not move.
This is now our mold.
Stand the boxes so that the funnel and the vent hole are at the top,
Calculate amount of metal required to fill our mold add say 20% as a fudge factor melt metal in furnace and pour into mold, put box aside and allow to cool
Separate boxes once cool and all being equal we should have a sand cast cylinder with a little metal funnel and possible a little metal from the vent hole, these need to be removed the outside of the cylinder cleaned and any machining preformed to archive our finished item.
If as in the case of the exhaust there is a hollow centre a plug in the shape required is made from a different type of sand( one that will hold the shape of the plug but will break down for easy removal after the metal has cooled) is then fitted into one half of the mold before the two are joined.
This saves us having to machine odd shapes that are hard to reach with machine tools and also cuts down on the amount of metal needed.
OK Jerry that's the down and dirty way of explaining casting from me hope it helps a little, it appears that Ted is thinking of a little dive trip in the South Pacific care to come along and bring your Boat I hear its a little chilly in the US at the moment, a little trip in 28-38C temps might not go astray.
Cheers from the S.P.
D.buck |
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