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 Author  Topic: German Flak Lighters
TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 9:30am
Guys;
If you want to really see something different in the modeling realm, check out this subject, This guy is scratchbuilding a flak lighter in 1/35th scale!
While I have only seen the two photos in Frank Johnsons book, this CAD diagrams really gives you a sense of what RON 15, 22, and 29 had to go up against, just looking at the diagrams made the hair stand up on the back of my neck and sent shivers down my spine! Two 88's, two quad 20mm mounts, a single 37mm, a single 20mm, plus what ever hand held machine guns might be on board!

here is the website:

http://www.modelshipwrights.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=193358&page=1

AWESOME!!

Take care,
TED


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PeterTareBuilder

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of PeterTareBuilder  Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 12:31pm
Ah someone made the link clickable. Thanks.

I had cut and pasted the link earlier to view the model. Wow! what a work that will be when it's finished.

I noticed the size difference between it and the S-Boote in the background of some of the images. That's going to be a decent size model.

Not to nit-pick but I also noticed that the builder of the model says the main guns were 10.5 cm not 88 mm.

What an adversary for PT boats to go up against! Even if they had a 40 mm mounted the PT boat would be at a disadvantage because the flak lighter had armour on at least the main guns and probably elsewhere as well.

Those PT boaters who were ordered out to engage those flak lighters had to have had a lot of grit.

Cheers from Peter



"Give me a faster PT boat for I'd like to get out of harm's way!"

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Will Day

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Will Day   Send Email To Will Day Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 12:59pm
Yeah, F-lighters were bad news for sure.

Will

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TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 3:21pm
Peter;
They might have had them on later versions(this is the second version known as the Flak Lighter ll). The 10.5 cm FlaK 39(105 mm gun with a rate of fire of 15 to 18 rounds per minute), was introduced to replace the 8.8cm FlaK 37/38(88mm gun with a rate of fire of 15-20 rounds per minute), but I believe most mounted the 88.
take care,
TED



Here is another model of one, at The Armed Forces Museum in Largo, Florida, I think this one is 1/72nd scale, it does not say, but is does say 88mm were mounted.


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TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 3:27pm
P,S, also look on bow, it looks like Nebelwerfer type rockets( NbW 41 28/32cm rockets) as carried on the sides of the Sd. Kfz 251/1 nicknamed "Stuka zu fuss" or "Ground Stuka".
Take care,
TED


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Frank J Andruss Sr

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Frank J Andruss Sr   Send Email To Frank J Andruss Sr Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 3:48pm
Although outgunned for sure, the PT BOATS biggest advantage here would be speed, and Radar. I understand even at a very low setting a torpedo would pass underneath the Flak Lighter. Imagine how one felt when going up against this beast. You would have to knock it out quickly if you could, because there would be no way in hell a PT BOAT would stick around and slug it out........


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  Jerry Gilmartin

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Jerry Gilmartin   Send Email To Jerry Gilmartin Posted on: Jul 12, 2012 - 11:08pm
Hello shipmates!
One of our PT veterans on PT658, GM2/c Frank LeSage was on the Port 50cal turret on PT205 of RON15 in the Invasion of Southern France. His boat went up against a German Flak Lighter and lost. Franks boat was hit with several 88mm shells and he was blown clear of the turret and ended up in the sea. He told me over half the crew was killed. The boat was found the next day still floating, and was towed back for repairs Frank still has a very healthy respect for these mini warships. They could not move very fast, and that was their only shortcoming. I have never seen a good model of one either. Jerry

Jerry Gilmartin

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TED WALTHER

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of TED WALTHER   Send Email To TED WALTHER Posted on: Jul 13, 2012 - 8:29am
Jerry;
While we also have Bob contributing his awesome photos of PT 305 in another topic thread, let us not forget that while PT 205 RON 15 and Frank LeSage and his crew got chewed up by one of these beasts, PT 305 actually sank one!
"PT-305, along with PT-302 through PT-313, was assigned to Motor Torpedo Boat Squadron 22 (Ron 22) operating along the coast of Southern France and Northern Italy. The boats participated in the Invasion of Elba on June 17, 1944, where PT-305 sank a German flak ship."
For an interesting PT 305/LT Allan Purdy/ USS Missouri (SSN-780)
follow on story from May 2010 go to this link:
http://cafnrnews.com/2010/05/returning-to-sea/
Take care,
TED
P.S. Hummm, wouldn't it be nice, if when PT 305 is complete and inside the museum, models of a flaklighter and her other kills were in a display case postioned near the boat?




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Will Day

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Will Day   Send Email To Will Day Posted on: Jul 13, 2012 - 10:26am
Scary looking beast....



Will

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Frank J Andruss Sr

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Frank J Andruss Sr   Send Email To Frank J Andruss Sr Posted on: Jul 13, 2012 - 6:19pm
I wonder what the tactic was for the boats when having to confront this monster. There must be a write up on it somewhere, just as they did with the Barge tactics in the Pacific. It probably read one word RUN!!...


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