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 Author  Topic: copyright
victorkchun

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 1, 2009 - 9:02am
The term of use reads "the information disclosed on these forums becomes public". Does that mean anyone can use the information?
How do one credit the source?
Victor

Victor K Chun

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Frank J Andruss Sr

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Frank J Andruss Sr   Send Email To Frank J Andruss Sr Posted on: Feb 1, 2009 - 9:28am
The information you put on the message board becomes public use, which simply means anyone can use it. However, the photo's that are put here still must carry a source of information if used in a publication. For instance, I put many photo's on the message board, but if you use them, you must credit whatever source they came from. That might be me, PT Boats Inc, Naval Institute, ect. I hope this is what you are asking.


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Jeff D

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Jeff D   Send Email To Jeff D Posted on: Feb 1, 2009 - 10:51am
To keep, say, a famous book author out of the hot waters of copyright infringement, you should get permission from sources not known to be in the public domain. Here's this board's Terms of Use, it doesn't give permission to use copyrighted material, which it doesn't have the right to, only a disclaimer:

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By using this forum, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless the owner(s) and moderator(s) of any claims resulting from your usage of this forum in the event of any damages to yourself or any party.

The owner(s) and moderator(s) takes no responsibility for accuracy, copyright compliance, legality or decency of any content or materials contained in these forums. Any messages posted by Authors of messages are not the opinion of the owner(s) and moderator(s) and they shall not be held liable for damages of any kind, to any party.

Please note that any information disclosed on these forums becomes public. For this reason we urge you to take caution when disclosing any personal information. No spam of any nature will be tollerated. Spam can be considered as, posting advertisements and generally promoting something off topic.
*******

Copyright issues on the internet are a big issue these days.


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victorkchun

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 1, 2009 - 1:51pm
Hi Frank,
You hit the nail right on the head. It goes without saying that credit
shall be given to the sourse. Can the "author" of the message be
cionsidered the source? For example: Frank J. Andruss, Jr., Jeff D,
etc.

Victor K Chun

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Frank J Andruss Sr

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Frank J Andruss Sr   Send Email To Frank J Andruss Sr Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 1:50am
If the author wrote the piece, why should they not get the crediit. In my upcoming book, I credited every source, but also with some photos for instance credited them as authors collection. Ask some of the guys their thughts like T.Garth Connelly, who wrote three books, and others. I think I am correct........


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TGConnelly

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 6:46am
Frank -

I'm sure I'd get corrected BUT - yes - I agree with you.

Garth


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Jeff D

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message     View Profile of Jeff D   Send Email To Jeff D Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 8:31am
Here's some basics according to http://inventors.about.com/cs/lessonplans/a/student_primer_5.htm:

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Literary Works
Copyright protects literary works of all types from novels such as Gone With the Wind or The Catcher in the Rye, to text books and other fact-based accounts, including newspapers. Although copyright covers the expression in non-fiction works, it does not cover the facts themselves. They are uncopyrightable and can be freely used by anyone. Copyright in the literary works also covers printed speeches such as Martin Luther King, Jr.'s famous "I have a dream" speech. Today, even computer programs are protected as literary works.

Pictorial, Graphic, and Sculptural Works
Works created by sculptors, photographers, painters, and other graphic artists are protected by copyright. The works covered include not only paintings, photographs, and sculptures, but also advertisements, the artwork on game boards, and the artwork on fabrics or textiles.

How Long is a Work Protected?
The 1790 copyright act provided only a fourteen year term. Mark Twain was one of the authors who persuaded Congress that the term should be longer. In 1909, the term was extended to protect authors for a twent-eight year term plus a possibility of twenty-eight more years if the author renewed his or her claim in a timely fashion. Then in 1976, the term was extended again to its current length: the life of the author plus seventy years. Special rules apply to works created by employees as part of their jobs such as motion pictures and anonymous or pseudonymous works.

When the term of the protection expires on a particular work, it may be used freely by anyone.

A work copyrighted in the United States is protected here as well as in all of the other countries with whom we have copyright relations by our membership in the two multilateral copyright treaties--the Universal Copyright Convention and the Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works, by presidential proclamation, or bilateral relations. The United States has copyright relations with over 100 countries.

It is illegal for anyone to violate any of the rights provided to the owners of the intellectual property by patents, trademarks, and copyrights.
*******

The way I see it is that if someone does research and states "at mid height the chart house on the ELCO 80' PT boat is 99" in width" it's perfectly OK to use. Giving credit would be honorable but not a copyright issue. If you get the same information from an image of someone holding a tape measure on PT 617 at Battleship Cove, the information would be OK to use but not the image (without permission). A similar image taken by the Navy in 1945 would be OK to use since most government works are not copyrighted.

Since you mentioned my name Victor, I wanted to let you know that the only copyrighted work I've posted on this board is a digital image of an early ELCO 80' boat turret. Any text I've posted is not copyrighted and about 50% wrong. The 50% part may be rather generous in my favor but I'm hoping to come across as an incomplete idiot.



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victorkchun

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 12:40pm
Thank you Frank, TG Connelly, and Jeff D, for your inputs on the subject of copyright. As a honorable gesture, I believe all images should be credited to the individuals or organizations. If specific individual can
not be traced, Frank's suggestion of credited them as someone's
COLLECTION sounds like a winner. Anyone who went through all the
trouble to post the image on the message board deserves to be
honored in my book (no pun intended).
Victor

Victor K Chun

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TGConnelly

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 1:27pm
Victor -

I would agree, but if someone posts a photo online ... then, because the internet being what it is sir, then that photo becomes public domain and anyone can take ownership of it and is not required to give any credit as to where they obtained it. It'd be nice and honorable and all that but if the photos aren't copyrighted somehow when the person posts them sir? They are free for the taking.

Garth


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newsnerd99

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Post a Reply To This Topic    Reply With Quotes     Edit Message   Posted on: Feb 2, 2009 - 4:16pm
Garth - as a professional photographer I can state with authority that you are incorrect. As others stated above, you can get into some very serious trouble for using a photo in a publication without permission.

Just because it is on the internet and easy to take does not mean you have the legal right to take and, more importantly, use.

With PT Boats and related photos it can become a grey area when it comes to the original photographer/source. There is a legalese situation called "orphaned works" when you try to track the source but to the best of your efforts, the source cannot be found. However, when someone here posts a photo you have a starting point from which to try and track it down. Not doing so runs the risk of losing several thousand dollars in legal settlements.

If you can track it down as being an original US Navy photograph, then they exist in the public domain and can be used free of charge. Of course, any reputable writer will always give credit regardless if they needed to secure the rights to a photograph or not.

This is actually a very hot topic in my industry right now - there is a big battle over how to handle orphaned works. Many people simply use a photo and the original photographer is either dead or never knows it is used. Others are given to the PT Boat Association, who then redistributes them to researchers, authors, etc. If there is no agreement between the original owner of the image and the association as far as use, etc. then techincally the image is still owned by the original photographer.

The big-time $$$ settlements are for books and non-news magazines that use an image even though they know they don't have the rights to it. Usually accidental image use is settled in a smaller $$ settlement.

Just like anything you would do involving a book - do your homework. It saves you a lot of grief in the end!

Grandson of James J Stanton
RON 15 PT 209 and RON 23 PT 243
Check out: www.pistolpackinmama.net

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